www.clanlivingstone.info

Hi All, As a followup to the previous info from Stewart and Niall regarding the Livingstone Tartan, I have a little more information regarding the Highland Society of London and tartans. This society appealed to the British Government to have the ban on the Tartan, except for the military, the Diskilting Act repealed which it was in 1782. Now it would seem logical that the Society would begin efforts to collect and register clan tartans imediately following the removal of the ban, but there appears to have been no efforts on the part of this society to identify these tartans until much later in 1815. Unfortunately by then, many of the clan weavers and oldtimers with knowledge of a specific or district tartan worn by their clan in the 18th century or before were deceased. Recall for example that our own Donald Livingstone of Morvern famous veteran of the Battle of Culloden and a known wearer of tartan, died the following year in 1816. What is known is that in 1815 the Highland Society of London finally made a serious effort to identify Clan tartans perhaps motivated by concerns that knowledge of these pre-Culloden tartan patterns would soon be lost forever unless something was done. It is at this time that Colonel Alistair MacDonnell of Glengarry on behalf of the Society contacted Clan Chiefs and asked that they send a sample of what they considered to be their tartan. As tartans had been banned from 1746-1782 and thereafter the weaves lost and forgotten, many clan chiefs had to consult with the few eldest members of the clan for information about tartans. Despite uncertainties among some clans as to what constituted their clan tartan a significant number submitted tartan samples which were identified and cataloged by Highland Society of London with each Clan chiefs stamp of approval. The question on my mind is where are these records of Colonel McDonnell and the Highland Society of London today and whether we could find an original submission document of Baron John Livingstone (1746-1835) great-grandfather of the current Baron Livingstone to this Society circa 1815. The National Library of Scotland has a collection of documents from this Society, but I do not think these records are there. As I do not live in Scotland, I am not much help, but perhaps some of you in the old country have the time and energy to take on the task of locating the original documents and if indeed they survive today. regards Donald (Livingstone) Clink

This sounds like a wonderful idea, Donald.

Hi Kyle, Thanks for the note of encouragement. Here is an interesting footnote regarding Colonel Alistair McDonnell of Glengarry of the Highland Society of London who encouraged clan chiefs about 1815 to submit samples of tartan fabric. Tonight, I noticed with interest that in Baron Livingstone's book of 1745-46 Jacobite Muster Rolls, "No Quarter Given" it is written that one Alistair Ruadh MacDonnell the eldest son of MacDonnell of Glengarry was absent from Battle of Culloden and the command was given to Glengarry's second son Angus. Another McDonnell regiment at Culloden was MacDonnell of Kepoch whose early tartan was apparently quite similar to Livingstone Tartan 1003. regards Donald (Livingstone) Clink

Another interesting find. Though the antiquity of the tartan in the 19th century appears to be pretty solid, it would be great to see that the Livingstones had provided some tartan or pattern to the 1815 effort. So I think this is important work, Donald!

Another interesting find. Though the antiquity of the tartan in the 19th century appears to be pretty solid, it would be great to see that the Livingstones had provided some tartan or pattern to the 1815 effort. So I think this is important work, Donald!

Hi Donald, Boy have you been busy!! According to the info I have from The Scottish Tartans Soc. Most of the samples in the 1815 collection carried the Seal of the Chief and if so the question remains was this sample'sealed' and if so,is it the seal of a Livingstone or MacLeay? The S T C was at the time of my enquiry. (some 15 or so years ago) trying to gain access to the collection to resolve this or other similar questions. There are, as you will be aware, several variations of the pattern which James Scarlett(1*) points out,"it has a resemblance, so marked that it can scarcely be accidental, to a tartan reproduced by D.W.Stewart (Old and Rare Scottish Tartans) from a relic of the '45' named MacDonald of Keppoch." the main difference between the two being the solid green band where the Keppoch has two narrow green bands. As mentioned before, the close proximity of the Keppoch-MacDonalds and Macleays could explain the similarity, ie that it originates from a pattern commonly woven in the area. The S T C go on to state that it is NOW commonly worn by the lowland Livingstons, but the evidence points to it having formerly a sett worn by the MacLeays. Stewart. (1*)James Scarlett,

Hi Stuart, Not only will the tartan sample have the seal of the chief, but also his signature. While Baron John Livingstone (1746-1838) was born the year the tartan was prohibited,it is almost certain that the Highland Livingstones and the Maconleas before him wore tartan. It also seems unlikely that Donald Livingstone of Movern (1728-1816) veteran of the Battle of Culloden who is known to have worn a tartan kilt would have suddenly in his last years of life taken it up as the latest fad. That being said I would not say and am in no position to say that Livingstone Tartan 1003 was "the" Maconlea clan tartan. I dont know that they had one in those pre Culloden days. Perhaps more realistically thhe Red-Green-Black weave with some earlier variations could very well have a popular in the district prior to the Battle of Culloden and as you mention Livingstone 1003 bears some similarity to old MacDonnell of Kepoch pattern. In any event there are people who spend their whole lives studying Tartans that have far greater insight into this tartan debate than I.

Hi Kyle, Ultimately I am no real position to state an actual date for Livingstone 1003, but I strongly suspect it to be pre 1815 and possibly based on a pattern and colours favoured by Maconleas and other Argyll clans at the time of the Battle of Culloden. THat is what I suspect, but whether I am correct I can't say. Certainly there is no evidence that this swatch even if it is found to be in this collection will turn out to be an ancient Maconlea clan tartan. I have no reason to believe one ever existed. Still that being said locating this 1815 fabric sample will be a worth while effort I should think. regards Donald

Hi All, The prevailing oppinion among many tartan experts is that the majority of tartans submitted to the Highland Society of London circa 1815 were infact not original clan tartans.Is a majority 50% +1,60%? I don't know. Some clan chiefs may have sourced their tartans from 18th century tartan manufacturer William Wilson, though we don't know that this was the source of Baron John Livingstone's tartan. Blair Urquart in his book "Tartans" identifys several clans of the southern highlands as being of the Glen Orchy District tartan group with tartans predominately consisting of red and green. THis includes Stewart of Appin, MacColls, MacGillivrary and I would add Livingstone ancient and modern to this list. While it is hard to argue the point that clan tartans as we know them today existed in the 18th century there is certainly no doubt that district tartans of one sort or another probably existed for some time in the highlands. A green-grey and black pattern is considered to be an old Mull district tartan and curiously ancient records show that the Macleans of Duart also wore this colour grouping. Urquart also gives us more information on the Highland Society of London tartan project of 1815. Convinced that there were many Clan chiefs who had clan tartans they went ahead with project and 1816 had collected about 74 tartan samples from those they had contacted. By the 1820's the collection was already suffering some deteriation and damage from moths and efforts were made to paste pieces of the fabric samples in a book. Fortunatley the original collection with the chiefs seals survived so that the tartan could be properly identified. Urquart indicates that the collection had been recently catalogued, and shows some photos of an original sample page from the collection and an index page. He does not however indicate where the original collection is located. His book was apparently published in 1994. regards Donald (Livingstone) Clink