Beaton Institute, Colin Livingston Inquiry

A Read-only Archive of the old forum. Many useful messages and lots of family data!

Beaton Institute, Colin Livingston Inquiry

Postby Barry Judson » Wed Jul 08, 2009 1:21 pm

Hi All I have yet to hear from the Archives about whether my documents are ready yet. I'll just have to dropin and see if they have done them yet. So the Catherine we are looking for was probably born in the same time frame as Colin...somewhere around 1818 and she was still alive in 1892. It said in the deed that she was Catherine of Forest Hill, but none of the census documents support this. Interesting too is the atlas of PEI for 1881 shows the 100 acres in Forest Hill as occupied by 50 acres for John Livingstone and 50 acres for Angus Livingstone and the deed in 1892 doesn't support this. It showed Angus getting the entire 100 acres in the deed from Catherine. I suspect that John Senior of Mull may have spent a short time on PEI before moving to Cape Breton and that is why there is the close association with the PEI connection. The most likely location for graves for my Catherine and Colin is in the Whycocomagh area of Cape Breton. Has anyone had the opportunity to go to the cemeteries in Cape Breton? This is the summer of weddings for me....I'm afraid i won't get to Cape Breton this year. Also I notice in my research there are some Livingstone's listed as Baptist, some Presbyterian, and the larger percentage Church of Scotland. Is there any relationship between their denomination and the area of Scotland they are from associated with the denomination? I suspect that the Colonsay Livingstone's in the Murray river area have a strong Baptist persuasion. Is this common for the Colonsay Livingstone's? I had an interesting find in the census documents. Colin's daughter, Mary married John Martin of Dundas. I found her as a widow in the census documents living across or next to her brother Angus in Upton. It lists all of her children and their ages. Roberta noticed the family of John and Catherine (Campbell) Livingstone in Scotland too. The birth dates for John, colin and Alexander on the mull website match with their mull and whycocomagh census birthdates. I have been trying to trace the rest of this family to possible matches in Canada and the US. My Livingstone family has always had strong ties over the years to Massachusetts, with exended family living there and moving there, remembered by my mother from when she was a girl. Just my thoughts after working all night....now off to bed. Barry
Barry Judson
 
Posts: 0
Joined: Sun Jan 18, 2009 4:54 am

Beaton Institute, Colin Livingston Inquiry

Postby Roberta Ann » Wed Jul 08, 2009 7:27 pm

Barry, Catherine 1808-1912 is buried in Hillsboro Cemetery, Whycocomaugh. By the way, we did the trip from Charlottetown to Cape Breton and back to Charlottetown in one day. Roberta
Roberta Ann
 
Posts: 602
Joined: Thu Jul 16, 2009 12:56 pm

Beaton Institute, Colin Livingston Inquiry

Postby Canadian Livingstone » Thu Jul 09, 2009 1:40 am

Hi Barry, Perhaps Forest Hill was just a temporary residence or she moved. Dr. St. Clair does not have a lot of info on John Livingston Sr., but it is reasonably certain that he and his wife Catharine or Mary Campbell originated from Mull and settled at Mull River, Cape Breton in the 1820's. There is a theory making the rounds that John and Catharine are the John Livingston and Catharine Campbell recorded in the Mull Parish records that according to a surviving Mull document left Mull around the year 1821. I have all this stuff including the document on file somewhere here. Dr. St. Clair has not found a land record for John Livingston Sr. at Mull River. No petition to the Crown for land or anything like that apparently. I would like to double check that with him as I am curious exactly how the family came into possession of that land and what the condition was. I will check my information and see what precisely Dr. St. Clair said about this. I do recall asking him about the possibility of land records for John Livingston sr. in the 1820's at Mull river we could locate. John I understand died around 1840 or before. The eldest son John Jr. I believe was born around 1800 perhaps 1808 if he is the son of the John Livingston and Catharine Campbell in the Mull Parish records that left their parish in 1821. It is a tantalising theory because as I found this particular family left Mull in the 1820's and had a large family which oddly enough included a older son John, a son Colin and and son Alexander all about the right age of those we know lived in Cape Breton in close proximity to each other. Perhaps a odd coincidence but it is definitely pointing to this family as the one that settled at Mull River. Sorry I dont have my notes and cant remember off the top of my head the Parish but I may have mentioned in past forum messages. It is easy to access previous messages on the forum regards, Donald
Canadian Livingstone
 
Posts: 2430
Joined: Wed Jul 15, 2009 9:00 pm

Beaton Institute, Colin Livingston Inquiry

Postby Canadian Livingstone » Thu Jul 09, 2009 1:47 am

Hi Barry, I guess there is no chance there is a death record for Colin's wife Catharine who died after 1892. I wonder where she died in PEI? DId you check for the Cemetery record with the local historical society in the Forest Hill area? regards, Donald
Canadian Livingstone
 
Posts: 2430
Joined: Wed Jul 15, 2009 9:00 pm

Beaton Institute, Colin Livingston Inquiry

Postby Canadian Livingstone » Thu Jul 09, 2009 2:07 am

Hi Roberta, Thats old Kate of nearby Mull River where she lived until she died. See my earlier posting from way back when on Old Kate. The locals thought she had special powers and was some kind of witch. When she died they covered all the mirrors in her house. Dr. St. Clairs mother attended the wake which took place in her home. He is related to her.The fact that she is buried at nearby Whycocomagh pretty much supports my theory that her husband John Jr. who died about 1860 was an older brother of the farmer Alexander Livingston of Whycocomagh and ultimately the brother of Barry's ancestor Colin Livingston also a one time residence of Whycocomagh. I think it was the case of two Livingston brothers marrying two Livingston sisters as Dr. St. Clair pointed out that OLd Kate b.1807 or 1808 had a younger sister Annie that was married to Alexander Livingston of Whycocomagh. I passed on the info you found on the Mull 1744 Census to the Baron and he was quite interested. I dont think he had seen it before. In a few weeks I will find out whether or not my Livingston ancestors were related to your Livingston ancestors. Right now there is some possibility that we may have shared the same ancestor several centuries ago in Western Argyll or Ireland but the results of the 67 marker test results will be much more precise. As Mull and the Morvern ancestral homeland of my Livingston ancestor are beside each other there is chance that some the Mull Livingstons tested and those from Morvern may be a close match or a match. Dont know until more Mull and Movern Livingtons are tested to be sure but we will see what happens with this test. regards, Donald
Canadian Livingstone
 
Posts: 2430
Joined: Wed Jul 15, 2009 9:00 pm

Beaton Institute, Colin Livingston Inquiry

Postby Barry Judson » Thu Jul 09, 2009 10:12 am

Hi Donald I stopped at the Archives today, but they were closed. The only place I have ever found Colin's wife Catherine mentioned was in the deed for the farm. She is very mysterious as to her whereabouts. It is possible Colin and she are in unmarked graves, but I can find no reference to them anywhere. I have been checking the logical cemeteries, but I'm thinking they are in a cemetery in Cape Breton. If they only were on PEI for 5 years or so before Colin died I would guess he was buried in the Whycocomagh area. Barry
Barry Judson
 
Posts: 0
Joined: Sun Jan 18, 2009 4:54 am

Beaton Institute, Colin Livingston Inquiry

Postby Canadian Livingstone » Thu Jul 09, 2009 11:00 pm

Hi Barry, Thats too bad. Sooner or later you hit a brick wall in your research. Could be buried in Cape Breton but I would think he would been buried in PEI near his son. Where are his sons buried? Where is Angus buried. Does the obituary give any clues where he was buried? Still you have found Colin your ancestor,found out the name of his wife, have a birth date and death date for Colin, you know that he came from Whycocomagh and is of Cape Breton origin something you did not know before. You have now proven his Whycocmagh origin with the 1861 Census record. So you cant say you have been wasting your time. And it now looks like my theory that Colin, Alexander of Whycocmagh and John Jr. of nearby Mull River are all brothers and sons of local pioneers John Livingston and Catharine? Campbell of Mull River natives of Mull Scotland. So you may not have reached all your research objectives but you certainly end up going home with a fabulous consolation prize as they say in the game show business. regards, Donald
Canadian Livingstone
 
Posts: 2430
Joined: Wed Jul 15, 2009 9:00 pm

Beaton Institute, Colin Livingston Inquiry

Postby Canadian Livingstone » Fri Jul 10, 2009 5:18 am

Hi Barry, Regarding your July 8th posting a few things from my info from Dr. St. Clair. He believes that the Mull River Livingstones settled in the 1820's at Mull River along with other Scots from Mull. While the census records indicated that old Kate and Alexanders wife Annie were born in PEI there was no evidence that John Livingston Sr. had a PEI connection. Colin's son or sons were in PEI where he died in 1867 but clearly he had been a resident of Cape Breton and born in Scotland, so it difficult to pinpoint a PEI family connection there. The PEI LIvingstone connection that we do know for certain is with Old Kate's and Annie's Livingston's family if any. The census clearly indicates that they were born in PEI. Dr. St. Clair however indicated that "other Livingstons" came from Nine Mile Creek, PEI I suspect this would be old Kate's family who might be connected to the Nine Mile Creek Livingstons of PEI decended from Donald and Mary Livingstone. I had suspected this and it makes sense if it is true. Dr. St. Clair was unaware that some Whycocomagh Livingstons(Angus son of Colin and his brother JOhn)Livingstones had gone to PEI but he was not surprised. The reason that Old Kate Livingston, John Livingston Juniors widow was buried in Whycocomagh is that there is no cemetery in Mull River where she lived on Livingston Mountain. Alexander Livingston and his wife Annie (old Kates younger sister) were the first Livingstons to live on Skye Mountain. Skye Mountain is where they lived at Whycocomagh. I suspect ALexander lived somewhere else and that some where else before his marriage was Mull RIver. Livingstones of Mull RIver (ie. John Livingston Sr. old Kate) never had a land grant or completed a petition for a land grant in the 1820's. He believes the family purchased the land. I was wondering then if there would be a record of the land transactions going back to the original purchase tranaction in the land office of the Township in Cape Breton where Mull River is today located or the Inverness County records. Also there is the Cape Breton Land Papers. Hopefully we can eventually check out the status of documents with land transaction information. As the Mull River Livingstons are likely your ancestors that is John Livingston Sr. b.1770's Mull, Scotland and Catharine Campbell. it is worth it some point to see if there is record of land purchases at Mull River although there may not be. The letter of reference that Mr. St. Clair has circa 1821 indicates that John Livingston and Catharine Campbell are natives of Kilninian and Kilmore, Island of Mull , County of Argyll which they have lived since infancy. Also information on payment for their passage 30 pounds for John and family of 9 aboard the brig "Adventure" bound of Pictou. regards, Donald
Canadian Livingstone
 
Posts: 2430
Joined: Wed Jul 15, 2009 9:00 pm

Beaton Institute, Colin Livingston Inquiry

Postby Canadian Livingstone » Fri Jul 10, 2009 5:43 am

Payment of Passage Record Tobermory (Mull) 22 June 1821 Received from John Livinstone and family in number nine as below noted thirty pounds, no stillings, sterling, being amount their freight per brig Adventure bound of Pictou
Canadian Livingstone
 
Posts: 2430
Joined: Wed Jul 15, 2009 9:00 pm

Beaton Institute, Colin Livingston Inquiry

Postby Canadian Livingstone » Fri Jul 10, 2009 5:51 am

Hi Barry, So we know this family went Cape Breton. The Montreal Gazette notes that the Brig Adventure set sail June 26 1821 from Liverpool with 112 settlers and after a journey of 60 days arrived at the Port of Quebec. So at least we know the ship was destined for Canada. Perhaps it stopped at Pictou as well. In any event this family did go to Canada and the Maritimes almost certainly and seems to be likely your ancestors. regards, Donalda
Canadian Livingstone
 
Posts: 2430
Joined: Wed Jul 15, 2009 9:00 pm

PreviousNext

Return to Old Forum Archive

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 1 guest

cron