Flags

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Flags

Postby Craig McClay Wilson » Tue Mar 09, 2004 6:22 pm

Niall, Congratulaions on the new website.  I have a question about the beautiful banner the Lyon Court authorized.  Can anyone use it or is it reserved the the Chief?  If the former, how could one procure a banner.  I would love to have one if appropriate. Craig
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Postby Bachuil » Wed Mar 10, 2004 12:40 pm

Dear Craig, In Scotland a coat of arms is awarded to an individual and his shield is quite unique.  The banner is simply the shield depicted covering the whole surface of the flag.  A clansmen cannot bear his chief’s shield, banner, standard or even crest.  However, the chief’s crest worn within the belt and buckle is properly worn by all clansmen as a cap badge. The Lyon Court have an information leaflet which can be seen at http://www.electricscotland.com/webclans/lordlyon2.htm.  It states "Much confusion exists about the meaning, use and entitlement to wear Scottish Crest Badges, and it is constantly increased by well—meaning but ill—informed explanations. This leaflet is authoritative in setting out the main facts. Even the popular name "Clan Crest" is a misnomer, as there is no such thing as a "Clan" Crest. The Crest is the exclusively personal property of the Clan Chief, and it is fully protected to him by the law in Scotland. The circumstances in which it may be worn by his clansmen are set out hereafter.” It is not as costly as one might think to petition the Lyon Court for a coat of arms.  Those living outwith Scotland who can document descent from a Scottish Ancestor should be able to petition for a coat of arms.  There is a mass of information on http://www.lyon-court.com.  I would seriously consider applying for your own coat – and with that you automatically get your own banner! Go for it! Regards, Niall
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Postby Rob Livingston2 » Wed Mar 10, 2004 5:37 pm

What is the policy for use of a clan banner at Clan games and gatherings where Clan MacLea might want to have a booth?  Assuming that the clan chief is not present, I'm assuming an appropriate flag is one with just the clan badge on it?
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Postby Bachuil » Thu Mar 11, 2004 1:02 am

Rob, At http://www.clanlivingstone.com/flags.htm you will see a Pinsel.  More information is given at http://www.heraldry-scotland.co.uk/Flyingheraldry.htm , http://www.scotsbarons.org/pinsel.htm  and http://www.baronage.co.uk/2001/badgesxy.html It is used to show that the holder has a commission from the chief to act in his name and was used by a commander in the chief’s absence. Today it is sometimes used at highland gatherings when a chief cannot be present in person. I have seen the purists argue that the clan crest should not be flown as a Clan flag. Therefore, in Scotland at least, a “clan tent” should exist with the approval of the chief and the person running it should have a commission so to do – and the Pinsel would be an appropriate demonstration of that authority. We have discussed the need to have clan representatives at various functions in places furth of Scotland and I am drawing up the wording of a suitable commission.  I have a safe full of ancient documents with stirring phrases such as: “NOW KNOW YE that WE, reposing great trust and confidence in your loyalty, etc , have authorised and appointed, and do by these Presents authorise and appoint you................as you will answer the contrary at your peril” It would be wonderful to have a Pinsel that could be despatched with it.  I shall give this more thought. Regards, Niall
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