Archibald Livingston of Lobo Township, Middlesex Cty.Ontario

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Re: Archibald Livingston of Lobo Township, Middlesex Cty.Ont

Postby Canadian Livingstone » Thu Apr 12, 2018 11:29 pm

Hi David,

Wow lots to look over. You have been working hard on this I can see, since we last were in contact. What progress you have made. And yikes that was a tough one. One piece at a time until you got it. I can't get precise idea of Alexander's birthdate in Scotland from the census records. Somewhere between 1803 and 1810 looks like, possibly in Mull, Argyll looks like now. Perhaps he had a brother named Angus.
Sure sounds like the right family. Alexander and Catharine Livingston. All children mentioned in that list in the book except a daughter Flora and a son Donald that I noticed. But quite easy when it is second hand info published in that book for the author to have missed a few children of Alexander and Catharine's from a large family like they had. All the rest in the book list seem to match the names in the 1851 and 1861 Census records in Quebec. Great that found what looks like a connection between that Angus and your Alexander.
That Mull information I think is new to me and not surprising as the vast majority of highland Livingstons whom who have contacted the forum whose ancestors settled in Canada seem to be connected to Livingston families from Mull or neighbouring Morvern, where my Livingston ancestors came from. In terms of the DNA project, although I am the Clan Historian, I have encouraged quite a significant number of persons of Livingston ancestry to participate in the DNA project having established a good deal of familiarity with the history of Livingstons the Mull and surrounding Western Argyll area of Scotland and familiarity with the DNA results with particularly with Western Argyllshire LIvingstons.

If your original source is correct then it is quite possible that the elder Archibald and his son Alexander born in the early 1800's have family origins apparently in Mull. And with those Quebec neighbours being McLeans and McPhees they are quite common to 18th and 19th century Mull and rest Cameron and McGillverary common to neighbouring Morvern and probably Mull. McVicar throughout Argyll some in Southern Argyllshire. So Archibald's neighbours very likely from Western Argyllshire I would assume. Like I say it seems quite often the Canadian Livingstons I worked with on the forum over the years have had an Mull Argyll Livingston ancestry. The 37 marker test is a good starting point or I would suggest the 67 marker test just to get a good sense of your closest match results with other LIvingstons in the DNA project who have done the 67 marker test which most Livingston of Mull ancestry have. Most of Livingstons of Mull ancestral origin and other parts of Western Argyll have done the 67 marker test and you can always upgrade to the 111 marker test later on for more precise matching of your results with other Livingstons whom you are determined to be a match with at 67 markers tested. So yes if you have info that your family originated in Mull then I really think the Y Chromosome Test offered by familytreedna for 67 markers is the way to go. While some Livingstons of Mull ancestry are not certain where their ancestors lived at Mull, others do have some info and I have started to try an actually draw a rough map of where some of their ancestors and other Livingston families lived at Mull in the 1700's and early 1800's. We have made a lot of progress with our Mull Livingston family research and the DNA project via familytreedna has proven to be a major help in learning just how closely related these Mull and Morvern Livingstons and Livingstons from other parishes in Western Argyll are to one another. There is one other Livingston DNA match group who have a Mull, Argyll connection who have also done the familytreedna test, so it is possible you could be a match with them as well. With either group if you are of Mull ancestry or of some there Argyllshire ancestry which you seem to be from what you told me about the Mull info and the fact that your ancestors neighbours are almost certainly of Argyllshire origin one way or another there is very good chance of a match with others in one of these Livingston DNA groups.

Here is some information from familytreedna regarding their Y Chromosome test options and the cost:

https://www.familytreedna.com/products/y-dna

Again nice work Dave finding that apparent lead on likely Mull ancestry of Archibald Sr. and his son Alexander and his son Archibald. Lucky break for you that your Livingstone family in Quebec was mentioned and that you happened to stumble across that old book. Your are the only Livingston who settled originally in Quebec that has contacted the forum. We've had lots from Nova Scotia origin, some of PEI origin, some of Ontario origin and some of Manitoba origin. Your the first with a Quebec connection, although your Livngstons later ended up in Ontario.

Over the years having done my own Livingstone family research and that of other familes I am related to I am sometimes amazed at what rare documents. old family photos are sometimes discovered. I am just sorry to say that less than two years after Father passed away a distant cousin put an old civil war era documented photo of my Great-great-great grandfather that had been in this old distant cousin's familes possessions for about 150 years. I knew of this cousin from another cousin I was working with on family history about 20 years ago, but had no idea that this other family knew about this picture and had it for years but kept in an unopened shoebox for years. Anyways I was so scared I would spill coffee on it after it arrived in the mail I placed the old 1860's carte de visite photo of my elderly ancestor who was born in the 1780's and died in 1871 safely in an airtight glass frame. I don't have a photo of my Livingstone great-great-great grandfather unfortunately but I do have a photo that was given me of his youngest son and his eldest daughter who was my ancestor. Many other rare old photographs, books maps, documents have come my way or I have found them over the years doing family research. Genealogy is not as interesting as archaeology to be sure, but occasionally you do find some lost family treasure.

regards,

Donald (Livingstone) Clink
Clan Historian
Canadian Livingstone
 
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Re: Archibald Livingston of Lobo Township, Middlesex Cty.Ont

Postby Canadian Livingstone » Sat Apr 14, 2018 10:45 pm

Hi David,
Yes contacting the folks with the Scotch Road Cemetery Association was a good idea. Alexander Livingstons neighbours were natives of Scotland like him, farmers and land owners in the area since the 1830's.

According to the Canada East (Quebec) 1851 Census Alexander Livington b. abt. 1803 in Scotland possibly in Mull, Argyll and his wife Catharine and family resided on a 100 acre lot at Concession 7 Lot 7 in the Scotch Road area in Grenville Township, Argentieul County, Quebec. His closest neighbour also on Con. 7-7 100 acres was Donald McArthur age 50 widower born in Scotland. Another neighbour was Alexander McPhee age 45 born Scotland and his wife Ann situated at concession. 8 lot 7. Samuel Campbell age 35 also born in Scotland and his wife Margaret were located at Concession 8 Lot 8. There is also information in the Agricultural info of the 1851 Census of Grenville Township that a Malcolm McPhee is located on 100 acres at Con. 7 Lot 7. Angus Livingston born abt. 1797 in Scotland widower is located at Concession 5 Lot 8 on 100 acres near Neil McGillverary who is located on Con. 6 Lot 7 on 200 aces.


I don't think we discussed Archibald's baptism record information in the past. I just noticed it today. By now you probably have as well. You have found I know just about every bit of info regarding Archibald that survives no doubt the genealogy sleuth that you are.
Interestingly the 1851 Quebec Census and the 1871 Ontario Census indicate that Archibald Livingston son of Alexander Livingston and Catharine McDonald of Grenville Township, Argenteuil County, Quebec was born abt. 1836. This conflicts of course with his other census info and his death info. But is it interesting to note that his 1836 Church of Scotland baptismal record from Grenville, Quebec states that he was born in 1836:

Church of Scotland St. Phillippe d'Argenteuil

Archibald lawful son of Alexander Livingstone and Catharine McDonald born on the first day of April in the year of our lord one thousand eight hundred and thirty six was baptized by me at Grenville on this the third day of August in the same year.

William Maur Minister of Grenville and Chatham

Witness: Christian McGregor


regards,

Donald
Canadian Livingstone
 
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Re: Archibald Livingston of Lobo Township, Middlesex Cty.Ont

Postby david.livingstone » Fri May 04, 2018 3:43 am

Hi Donald, I received an email notification regarding a post back on Apr 30. I read it briefly but didn't have an opportunity to respond, and now that I look at the thread it's gone! From what i recall you indicated there were Livingstones in Wyoming, Ontario? I'd like to dig into that a bit deeper and see if I can perhaps find a connection to the Livingstone family in Quebec.
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Re: Archibald Livingston of Lobo Township, Middlesex Cty.Ont

Postby Canadian Livingstone » Fri May 04, 2018 1:26 pm

Hi David,

Yes I am afraid I started to edit my post and then deleted it because I was concerned it would create a certain amount of confusion regarding the three Lambton County Livingston family groups from Morvern, Appin and Lismore who by some interesting coincidence all settled in Lambton County in Bosanquet, Plympton and Sarnia Township in Lambton County. I am going to post my earlier research on these families and possibly do an article on them in the future. My own Livingstons of Morvern, Argyll ancestry and related Clink family settled in Bosanquet Township, some Appin, Argyll Livingston familes settled in Plympton County and the youngest son of Baron Coll Livingstone of Bachuil Lismore, Argyll settled in Sarnia Township. All of these families did not know each other apparently in Argyllshire but by some interesting coincidence settled in Lambton County in the 1850's or 1860's. I had done extensive Lambton County research on all of these different families and went through it the other day and could no evidence of an obvious connection with your family and so far no evidence of Archibald briefly living in Wyoming Ontario which is around the Plympton Township area in Lambton County in the 1880's or 1890's. That book that you quoted with mention of Archibald residing in Wyoming was published I think in the 1890's if I am correct, but I have checked the 1861, 1871, 1881 and 1891 Ontario Census info and there is not information suggesting he ever lived in Wyoming Ontario, or anywhere near Lambton County in those years. I am not ruling out the possibility that Archie could be a distant relative of one of these Livingston families and as I mentioned the familytreedna Y Chromosome would likely indicate which Argyll Livingstone family group your Grenville, Quebec/Lobo Township, Ontario Livingston family group is most closely related to. That being said it was a good guess on my part that the author might have been referring to Archibald perhaps briefly residing in Wyoming, Ontario rather than Wyoming, U.S.A. and I suspect most people in Ontario are not aware of a village in Ontario named Wyoming. I must admit I was not.

But Wyoming in the Plympton Township, Lambton County area is a considerable distance in Ontario from where we know from the Ontario Census Archibald and his family were residing in the second half of the 1800's, so there is I assume something not quite right regarding this author's statement that your ancestor Archibald lived in Wyoming either in the village of the Wyoming, Ontario or Wyoming in the USA. Here in summary is what the Ontario Census is telling us about the whereabouts of Archie in second half of the 1800's:
Archibald Livingston's whereabouts in Ontario based on Ontario Census records from 1861 to 1901
1861 Innisfil Township, Simcoe County, Ontario

1871 Innisfil Township, Simcoe County, Ontario

1881 Innisfil Township, Simcoe County, Ontario

1891 Lobo Township, Simcoe County, Ontario

1901 ? Archie seems to be missing in 1901 Census and not listed at his residence in Lobo Township, Middlesex County. Wonder what happened to him? Found wife Susana residing in 1901 according to census at residence of son Thomas A. Livingston b. May 8, 1856, His mother Susana according to same census was born Feb. 14, 1838 in Canada of Scotch ancestry. Where is Archibald? This could be why some people thought Archie died about 1901. The death record stated 1907 didn't it?


Died April 1st 1907 Lobo Township, Simcoe County, Ontario Can we confirm and verify that this death record is accurate and that he died in Lobo Township, Simcoe County? I forget now did you locate a tombstone in Lobo Township? Odd that he is absent from his residence in Lobo Township when the 1901 Census was taken.

regards,

Donald
Canadian Livingstone
 
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Re: Archibald Livingston of Lobo Township, Middlesex Cty.Ont

Postby david.livingstone » Fri May 04, 2018 3:03 pm

Ok, thought I was going crazy as it was late at night when I quickly read the post!

In 1901 Archibald was living with his son Archibald N.

Archibald Sr. month and day of birth are listed as 'unknown' but year is 1835. They are family 11:

https://www.bac-lac.gc.ca/eng/census/19 ... id=2656289

I've always wondered why he and his wife Susannah were not listed in the same house.
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Re: Archibald Livingston of Lobo Township, Middlesex Cty.Ont

Postby Canadian Livingstone » Fri May 04, 2018 3:30 pm

Hi David,

Well I thought for a moment that I could connect your Archibald with Wyoming, Ontario but I had not looked at our old discussions on Archibald in the past and once refreshing my memory regarding Archibald's census locations I realized that I would lead you or should I say mislead you probably on a wild goose chase searching for a connection to Wyoming Ontario that which does not seem to exist at least for Archibald.

Interestingly one Livingston family who lived in Plympton Township has a Livingston descendant who who did the familytree DNA test several years ago. He was descended from Angus Livingston of Port Appin, Argyll so an Appin, Argyll Livingston family. So if you do eventually decide to go with the familytreedna test I mentioned then it may help to indicate if your Livingstons might have been related to Angus and other LIvingstons of his family that lived in Plympton Township, Lambton County, Ontario or to my Livingstons who are a known be connected to Livingston family that lived in Morvern and neighbouring Mull. The information you found suggests the possibility of a Mull Livingston connection in your family in which case there is very good chance you share a common Livingston ancestor with my Livingston family but I learned with working with descendants of Argyllshire LIvingstons that if there means of proof then there is only speculation to rely on.

I understand the this village of Wyoming is in the Plympton Township area. I think in more recent years the community of Wyoming and Plympton Township amalgamated or something like that. Coincidentally, I had done some research on the three groups of Livingstons originating from MOrvern, Appin an Lismore who settled in Plympton, Sarnia and Bosanquet Townships Lambton County, Ontario in the 1850's including my own Livingston relatives. So oddly enough this Wyoming thing had got back into doing the finishing touches of a rough draft on them and perhaps a future article on this interesting group of Appin, Lismore and MOrvern Western Argyllshire who by odd coincidence ended up in Lambton County, Ontario. I assume the likely did not know each other. The Appin and Lismore ones, DNA testing has proven were distant cousins and not related by blood to the my Livingston relatives of Morvern Argyll ancestry who settled nearby to them in Bosanquet Township, Lambton County, Ontario.

It has now been more than 10 years that I have been studying highland Argyllshire Livingston settlement in Canada and the United States in the 1700's and 1800's and there have been a great many Livingstons who have contacted the forum or me personally and I have learned a great deal from them and each has I found an interesting story to tell as is the story of your Livingston family in Quebec and Ontario. Some have found more information than others on their family history. Some have information about their ancestors back in Scotland and others have no information regarding their family prior to their arrival in the United States or Canada.

What is a great about this forum is that once a Livingston posts his or her information on their family then it is quite possible that we can help them find more info and once all this information appears in the posts it is quite conceivable that some distant Livingston relative with information or looking for information on their Livingston ancestors will see a Livingston post pertaining to their Livingston family and try to make contact. This has happened from time to time here at the forum. This forum is all about sharing genealogy information and for me everyone's contribution has given me in the end I think an pretty good understanding of the various origins and places of settlement of the Livingston ancestors of many people of Livingston descent who have visited this Forum since 2004.

I did not know much about Argyllshire Livingstons who settled in Quebec except my Livingston ancestor's son from his first marriage who became a surveyor in the early 1800's in Beauharnois, Quebec and died in Quebec in 1862. He did not marry and had no family so there was no Quebec descendants regrettably to search for. My Livingston ancestor tried to get him to farm with him in Ontario in the early 1800's but the son from the first marriage apparently was not happy with his father for remarrying and while I found a legal document exists in the Quebec records between my ancestor his father from Ontario and him that I have not had to chance to look at, from the 1830's, the son from the first marriage seemed quite happy to remain in Quebec where he did quite well as a land surveyor.

I noticed a number of LIvingstons lived in Quebec in the early 1800's some of them likely of the Argyllshire variety including your family. Probably not a big number but there were some for sure. You are as I was mentioning the only Livingston so far of Quebec origins that has contacted this forum.

I know you mentioned recently you were considering the DNA test as a viable option. A number of our own Maclea- Livingtons in our Clan Society have done this test including our own Clan Chief and our North American Clan Commissioner and Chieftain and my Livingston cousin and many other LIvingstones/Livingston from around the world. If you like I can get you any information you need about our Clan DNA project and familytreedna who are a reliable company responsible for the testing and we could discuss any questions you have about the test and see if there is test option that could possibly work for you as there a number of different Y Chromosome Test options with familytreedna with 12, 25 37 or 67 or 111 markers tested. The 12 marker test is the lowest cost option and is good starting point and one can always upgrade later to the other comprehensive tests. Familytreedna sends you kit with instructions, you or one of your Livington relatives does the test, mails the sample back to familytreedna and bingo in several weeks you can see the closest Livingston matches on the familytreedna matches page. I have worked over the last 10 years with a number of Livingstons of Mull Argyll ancestry and neighbouring Morvern Parish where my Great-great-great Grandfather Livingston originally from. We also have a Mull Livingston expert who still resides in Scotland who has contributed much information regarding Mull Livingstons to this forum over the years. The ancient ways of the highland Clans may be gone in most respects and perhaps to some all we have left is a romantic's nostalgia for a past that is no more, but I like to think that here at Forum that Livingstones/Livingstones whatever their origins are one big family like in the Argyllshire days of old.


regards,

Donald
Canadian Livingstone
 
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Re: Archibald Livingston of Lobo Township, Middlesex Cty.Ont

Postby david.livingstone » Fri Aug 24, 2018 11:06 pm

Hi Donald - trust all is well. Wanted to share some updates with you:

First, I decided to proceed with DNA testing, and started with AncestryDNA as I have an active membership there and I'd like to see matches to my existing trees, etc. Those results are back, and they've provided some excellent insight into my Archiblad ancestor from Quebec (more on that below).
Today I also ordered the FamilyTreeDNA 67-marker test, and joined the Livingston/MacLea project. Once those test results are in I'll follow up.

As I said, the AncestryDNA test has been extremely helpful, and has provided what I believe is a link to my Archiblad from Quebec.

In your initial post in this thread, you provided this:
"There is only one other Archibald Livingston in the 1851/52 Quebec/Canada East Census records and he is born abt. 1828 in Quebec and he resided in Lacome Parish, Terrebonne County with his widowed father Neil Livingston born abt. 1791 in Scotland and Archibalds sibblings Sarah and Daniel. Due to the incomplete nature of the surviving 1851/1852 Census in Canada it does present some challenges."

I discounted this family early on due to the difference in birth year for Archibald, but it turns out that was a mistake! I believe, through a LOT of searching, that this Archibald is my great-great grandfather.

My DNA matched to 2 individuals in a family tree on ancestry: I was a 3rd cousin match to a woman and a 4th cousin match to her son. Unfortunately, investigating the linked tree didn't yield a surname I was familar with. After hours and hours of investigation I found that the tree owner had incorrectly linked evidence along the way, and there was certainly a Livingstone connection there - a link the tree owner was completely unaware of!

To explain why I believe this to be the case, I'm going to include a bunch of evidence, but first a brief re-cap of where we ended up:

If you recall, I am certain of my link to Archibald Livingstone of Innisfil, Simcoe County, Ontario, shown on the 1861 census with his wife Susannah, Susannah's father Thomas Doig, and Archibald and Susannah's two sons Thomas and Alexander. A multitude of evidence exists in support of this, and although Archibald's reported age varied greatly in the census records, his place of birth was consistenly reported as Quebec.

In the 1851 census for Lacorne, Terrebonne, Quebec, we have an Archibald Livingstone, father Neil (widowed), sister Sarah, and brother Daniel as you mentioned in your original post:
https://www.bac-lac.gc.ca/eng/census/18 ... mid=838052
Code: Select all
Line  Name                   Born           Religion             Mar  Age  Est. Birth Year
33    Neil Livingstone       Scotland       United Presbyterian  W    60   1792
34    Sarah Livingstone      L.C. (Quebec)  United Presbyterian  S    27   1825
35    Archibald Livingstone  L.C. (Quebec)  United Presbyterian  S    24   1828
36    Daniel Livingstone     L.C. (Quebec)  United Presbyterian  S    22   1830

Now to present my DNA evidence:

The woman who matched as my 3rd cousin is still alive, and I'll refer to her as S.B. S.B's grandmother, Margaret Seaton, is where I'll begin:

Margaret Seaton was born around 1864 in Ontario. In the 1871 census for Glenelg, Grey South, Ontario we see Margaret with family:
https://www.bac-lac.gc.ca/eng/census/18 ... id=2667501
Code: Select all
Line  Name             Born      Religion      Mar  Age  Est. Birth Year
1     James Seaton     Scotland  Presbyterian  M    45   1826
2     Sarah Seaton     Quebec    Presbyterian  M    46   1825
3     Mary Seaton      Ontario   Presbyterian  S    15   1856
4     William Seaton   Ontario   Presbyterian  S    13   1858
5     Anne Seaton      Ontario   Presbyterian  S     9   1862
6     Margaret Seaton  Ontario   Presbyterian  S     7   1864
7     Niel Seaton      Ontario   Presbyterian  S     4   1867

I'll draw your attention to Margaret's mother, Sarah, born about 1825 in Quebec. In the 1851 census for Lacorne, Terrebonne, Quebec we have a Sarah, sister of Archibald Livingstone, with age matching. So far so good.

In the 1861 census for Glenelg, Grey, Canada West Sarah is present (surname written as Sayton in census, but I now know this to be incorrect - it was Seaton - and that presented some difficulty in researching the family!):
https://www.bac-lac.gc.ca/eng/census/18 ... id=1583271
Code: Select all
Line  Name            Born      Religion                  Mar  Age  Est. Birth Year
6     James Seaton    Scotland  Free Church Presbyterian  M    35   1826
7     Sarah Seaton    Scotland  Free Church Presbyterian  M    34   1827
8     Mary Seaton     Canada    Free Church Presbyterian  S     4   1857
9     William Seaton  Canada    Free Church Presbyterian  S     3   1858
10    Ann Seaton      Canada    Free Church Presbyterian  S     1   1860

Note there is slight discrepancy in the place born and estimated age, but I'm not concerned at this. I'm certain it is the same Sarah.

It was the marriage and death records for Margaret that provided the "ah-ha!" moment for me: Her father is listed as James Seaton, and her mother as Sarah Livingstone.

Incidentally, it also shows that Margaret is buried in the 6th line cemetery, and if you recall, this is where you found Archibald and Susannah's young son Alexander! Margaret and husband settled in Innisfil.

So at this point, I have a confirmed DNA link to a Sarah Livingstone that was born about 1825 in Quebec! And what a coincidence that this Sarah in the 1851 census has a brother Archibald, who is the only other Archibald we were able to find in Quebec for the time period.

It gets better:
On the same 1851 census for Lacorne, Terrebonne, Quebec, further up the same page as the Livingstone family, there is this family:
Code: Select all
Line  Name                  Born          Religion             Mar  Age  Est. Birth Year
14    Andrew Banks          Scotland      United Presbyterian  M    34   1818
15    Margaret Livingstone  Scotland      United Presbyterian  M    31   1821
16    Mary Anne Banks       Lower Canada  United Presbyterian  S     5   1847
17    Elizabeth Banks       Lower Canada  United Presbyterian  S     2   1850

Turns out the census enumerator (John Murray) recorded the maiden name of all married women (what a fantastic idea!). On line 15 we have a Margaret Livingstone married to Andrew Banks, with children Mary (b1818) and Elizabeth (b1821). I was curious about this family and where they ended up, so I searched the 1861 to see if I could find them. And you'll never guess where they are - Innisfil!

Unfortunately I was unable to find an image for the census, but here's a transciption:

Banks: https://www.ogs.on.ca/ogspi_pages/6ab/c ... .htm#banks
BANKS 1861 census on380 page 020 line 46 @ca.on.simcoe_county.innisfil_township section 1 film C1073 lds0349321
46 BANKS Andrew m 41 married
47 BANKS {?} Margaret▼ f 35 married
48 BANKS Mary▼ f 13
49 BANKS Elizabeth▲▼ f 10
50 BANKS Daniel▼ m 8

BANKS 1861 census on380 page 028 line 01 @ca.on.simcoe_county.innisfil_township section 1 film C1073 lds0349321
01 BANKS Margaret▲▼ f 6
02 BANKS Archibald▲ m 3

We have the same Banks family!

It gets even better.

In the "Simcoe County Directory and Gazeteer, 1866-1867" I found both Andrew Banks and Archibald Livingstone:

Page 181, Township of Innisfil, Andrew Banks, Concession 7 Lot 18h
Page 185, Township of Innisfil, Archibald Livingstone, Concession 7 Lot 19h

They lived beside each other!!

My theory is this:
- Margaret Livingstone, married to Andrew Banks, is a sister to Sarah, Archibald, and Daniel
- When the Banks decided to come to Ontario, Sarah and Archibald joined them (not sure about Neil and Daniel at this point - I have more reaserch to do)
- Archibald was a farm Laborer (this is known from census records) and may have been working for Andrew Banks, his brother-in-law, or even for Thomas Doig, who lived right next door (in 1867)

This would explain how Archibald and Susannah met!

This is where I am in my research, and wanted to share these details in the hope that it will benefit others on the forum.

What I would really like to find are the marriage records for Sarah Livingstone and James Seaton, and Archibald Livingstone and Susannah Doig, but I'm really not sure where to start. My hope is that having those (if they exist) would provide additional insight.

Much more for me to do!

Thanks again Donald for your assistance with this over the years!!

I'll keep this thread updated as I learn more.
david.livingstone
 
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Re: Archibald Livingston of Lobo Township, Middlesex Cty.Ont

Postby Canadian Livingstone » Sat Aug 25, 2018 1:49 am

Hi David,
Hope you've been having a good summer. It has been a warm one for sure. Hard to imagine there was time once long ago when we did not have air conditioners and just opened a window and enjoyed cool summer breezes.

Thank-you very much for sending me the latest update regarding your Livingston family research efforts. I have enjoyed working with you on this challenging and most interesting Canadian Livingston family research project in the past and following your efforts. And fantastic news that you are taking that next step into the exciting world of genealogy DNA testing with the two tests. Our Clan group has for some time been working with Y Chromosome test with familytreedna. My Livingston cousin did the 67 marker test with familytreedna as well more than 10 years ago and I worked with family research with many of the people from his group and two other DNA groups over the year confirmed with Argyllshire records to as have a Western Argyllshire Livingston ancestral connection. I suspect your familytreedna results may also prove to be a match with one of these three groups if your ancestor lived in highland Argyllshire prior to settling in Canada. It will probably take a few weeks to get your test kit with familytreedna and then you may have a wait about a month or so for your results and see which Livingston group you are matching with. This is great news. Looking forward to hearing about the results.

I will take a look at your latest theory tomorrow regarding your Quebec Livingston family as it sounds quite interesting. It has been a while since we first started on this project so I may have to refresh my memory and go back to the original Quebec Livingston info we started with.


regards,

Donald
Canadian Livingstone
 
Posts: 2547
Joined: Wed Jul 15, 2009 9:00 pm

Re: Archibald Livingston of Lobo Township, Middlesex Cty.Ont

Postby Canadian Livingstone » Sat Aug 25, 2018 2:09 pm

Hi David,

That is interesting how you have found someone from this other Quebec Livingston family connected to Innisfil,Simcoe County. It may even also be that both Quebec Livingston families were related somehow back in Scotland, but it is a interesting connection that you have found linking this other Quebec Livingston family to INNisfil and this Banks and the Seaton family. The familytreedna Y chromosome test will be useful in showing you possibly a number of other related Livingston families and may match your with some of these other Livingston families who may Scottish parish records of their ancestors giving you some significant clues as to what County and even perhaps the parish in Scotland where your Livingston ancestors came from. That is main advantage of that test. And if you are really lucky a Livingston cousin you've never met may take the test and be a match with. Generally the Livingston matches with the this Y chromosome test are other Livingston families who shared an ancestor with you in the 1700's or earlier. To be really certain about which of these two Livingson families from Quebec are related to you a match a Y chromosome DNA test of a descendant of these two Livingston families would most definitely confirm it. Of course finding two documented and proven male Livingston descendants of the two families and then interesting them in dong this Y chromosome test would prove to possibly to be not so easy. But it would definitely determine beyond doubt which of the Quebec Livingston families you are descended from if there was any doubt.

regards,

Donald
Canadian Livingstone
 
Posts: 2547
Joined: Wed Jul 15, 2009 9:00 pm

Re: Archibald Livingston of Lobo Township, Middlesex Cty.Ont

Postby Canadian Livingstone » Sat Aug 25, 2018 3:34 pm

Hi David,

I feel a tad bit uncomfortable casting any possible doubt regarding the other Alexander b. abt. 1827 or 1828 in Lower Canada (Quebec) to a Scottish Livingston family being your actual ancestor Archibald Livingston but I found today information strongly suggesting that this other Archibald Livingston who lived in 1851 in the Montreal suburb area of Terrebonne actually left Quebec in the 1850's and settled in the Kingston area of Ontario and married a Selina Scobell and died in the Kingston area in 1909. You are correct there were two Archibald Livingstons of Scottish Livingston fathers but I think the census info is stating that this other Archibald born in 1827 or 1828 in Quebec to Neil Livingston settled in Kingston, Ontario before 1861 and therefore is not your ancestor. His Census records also consistent,record as being born around 1828 or 1827. I regrettably suspect you may be wrong about Archibald Livingston born near Montreal at Terrebonne. HIs gravestone info also in Kingston confirms he was born near Montreal which Terrebonne I understand is.

Here is in summary is the census info for this Archibald Livingston born abt.1827 or 1828 in Quebec and residing in 1851 at Lacorne, Terrebonne Quebec.

1851 Census Archibald Livingston age 24 born Quebec (abt. 1828) Lacorne, Terrebonne County, Quebec ( suburb of Montreal)

1861 Census Archibald Livingston age 34 born abt. 1827 lower Canada Kingston, Frontenac, Ontario

1871 Census Archibald Livingston grocer age 44 b.abt. 1827 Quebec Kingston, Frontenac, Ontario

Cemetery info in Kingston, Frontenac Archibald Livingston b. 1827 Montreal region d. 1909 Kingston, Frontenac
Wife Selina Scobell son John S. Livingston

It is still possible your Livingston family is related to this other Livingston family that lived in Terrebonne County. Lots of Livingston families in Scotland are related to one another and perhaps ones that both settled in Quebec could be cousins. But in terms of your principal Livingston family from which your ancestor Archibald Livingston was born into, I am still reasonably certain that Angus Livingston born in 1836 or 1837 in Quebec to Alexander Livingston Sr. of Grenville, Deux Montagnes, appear in 1851 Census there age 15 son and the Alexander Livingston who subsequently by 1861 lived in Simcoe County, Ontario and later Middlesex County, Ontario is your Livingston ancestor and not this younger Livingston who lived near Montreal and by 1861 in Kingston, Ontario. Pretty sure he is one that settled in Kingston Ontario in the 1850's and was married to this Selina maiden name apparently Scobell. I feel awkward challenging your latest research, but I thought better that you be aware of what I found out regarding where the Archibald Livingston born in 1827 or 1828 in Quebec you are thinking is your ancestor actually went before 1861in Ontario according to census records.

regards,

Donald
Canadian Livingstone
 
Posts: 2547
Joined: Wed Jul 15, 2009 9:00 pm

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