Angus Livingstone& Margaret (Hall/McPhail), Shiaba, Mull

[jmlivingstone]

Hi Donald,

Another bit of info to add to the list;

1. Neil McLean Livingstone, b.16 Sept. 1899 @ 1, Lochrine Terrace, Edinburgh, parents; Neil McLean Livingstone, pianoforte dealer, & Elizabeth Cooper.

Neil married Lillian Morgan Simpson, 21, Feb. 1919 @ 142, High St., Elgin.

Lillians parents were Wm. Simpson, marine engineer, & Emily Ethel Morgan, res. 6, Hope St., Portgordon.

Neils occ. was, tramway car driver, at the time of marriage, he was a private in the 76th. Battalion, Argyll & Sutherland Highlanders, which was part of BEF in France.

2. When Gavin Livingstone, m. to Catherine McLean, died 03 Mar. 1905, age 68, @ Northfield, Dunoon, his parents were listed as James Livingstone, occ. farmer, & Agnes Edmiston, all the other details, including his wifes name, Catherine McLean, point to the fact, his parents should have been John & Agnes.

I'd had a look at Keiths latest 67 point test results, & was going through old info when I found the above, the chances are it's another mistake by the registrar, although, how it could go from John, hand loom weaver, to James, a farmer, I'm not too sure.

There does not appear to be a James Livingstone m. to Agnes Edmiston in either Scotlands People or Family Search, so I suppose it could be another mistake,

John







John

[Canadian Livingstone]

Hi John,

I wish I could figure it all out. THe dna results are often full of surprises but are useful and helpful in better understanding ones origins and which Livngstons are related to you. You may not be in fact as closely related as was thought with Keith but I am not expert in dna intrepretation. It is clear however that both you and Keith are part of a group of descendants of a highland Maclea Livingstone dna group which resided in Western Argyllshire for centuries. There are so far about 14 Livingstons in this particular group some more closely related apparently and some apparently quite distant.
regards,
Donald

[Kyle MacLea]

If either of you want to discuss the interpretation of the DNA results within the cluster further, email me. I am slow at responding these days but will get to it as soon as I can.

We can also discuss specific relationships if you are confused or want to reevaluate our records a bit. Happy to do so together--you guys remember the records MUCH better than me!

Kyle=

[jmlivingstone]

Hi Kyle,

Thanks for your offer to explain the interpretation of the DNA results, they don't make a lot of sense to me, I'll stick to engineering.

I've just came across an old e-mail from Andrew explaining it, this was probably sent about a year ago, possibly longer, this was when he split the Parker - Livingstone Group into sub-groups, this explained all I was wanting to know.

Again, thanks for your offer of assistance,

John

[Kyle MacLea]

No problem and the offer stands if you want more later on!

All best
Kyle=

[Canadian Livingstone]

Hi John,

Regarding your ancestor Angus Livingston's military service in the late 1700's early 1800's with the Argyll Fencibles. More info on the Argyl Fencibles from an 1898 book by John N. Macleod "Memorials of Rev. Norman Macleod"
" The threat of French invasion aroused patriotic feeling of the nation in a most wonderful manner, and nearly every man capable of bearing arms was enrolled in volunteer corps for the defence of the country. A most loyal and martial spirit existed in Argyllshire and over the Highlands generally. Three Regiments of 'Fencibles' were at the time raised in the county. ... When the volunteers were enrolled there was a company in every parish in Argyllshire. There were eight companies in Mull and Morven under the command of Major Maxwell, a strict disaplinarian."

In terms of a time frame a book by Major General David Stewart intitled " Sketches of the character and present state of the Highlands of Scotland with details of the Miltary Service" states that regarding the Argyll Fencibles that following the declaration of 1793 the Marquis of Lorne raised the a regiment of Argyll Fencibles and in 1794 a second regiment was raised under the command of Colonel Henry Clavering with service extended in Ireland until the the peace of 1802.

Also apparently in 1799 a decision was made apparently to eventually disband Fencible Regiments that were defending Great Britain and Ireland except for men who had volunteered to serve in EUrope. For the remaining men the pay was increased and those who qualified received a disability pension. i dont know exactly how Angus Livingston fit into this but is clear he was deed elible in 1801 or around that time to start receiving an disability pension and around this time or a short time later he left the Army in Ireland to return to Scotland where he married, started a family and eventually returned with them to his ancestral homeland of Ross of Mull.

The French were giving assistance to the Irish Rebellion of 1798 and some of the Argyll Fencibles served on Garrison duty in Ireland during the 1798 Rebellion to defend against both rebel attacks and any attacks by the French so again we a have a good time frame for when Angus might have actually arrived and served in Ireland.

regards,

Donald

regards,
Donald

[jmlivingstone]

I have just came across another two members of this family g/daughters of John Livingstone & Agnes Edmiston, & daughters of James Livingstone & Flora McDougall ;

1. Isabella McLellan widow of Alexander McLellan, occ. road surface man, died 15 Apr. 1957 at Schoolhouse Cottage, Ballygrant, Islay, death registered by her daughter, Flora McLellan.

2. Ann Buie wife of Angus Buie, occ. distillery worker, died 31 July 1922, she was found dead on the footpath from Caol Ila to Port Askaig, death registered by her neice Isabella McLellan.

John

[Canadian Livingstone]

Hi John,

In past discussions we have discussed John Livingston and agnes Edmiston, James Livingston and Mary Mcmillan and Malcolm Mcmillan and Christy Livingston of Colonsay as being kin to Angus Livingston of Uragaig, Colonsay circa 1841. Interesting that their parish records appear closely together.

Colonsay Livingston Marriages located on one page of the old Register book
Malcolm Mcmillan and Christy Livingston m. January 26, 1840
James Livingston and Mary McMillan m. April 15, 1842

Colonsay Livingston Baptisms located on one page of the old Register book
Neil son of John Livingston and Agnes Edmiston baptised June 18, 1842
Donald son of Malcolm McMillan and Christy Livingston baptised October 11, 1842
Ann daughter of James Livingston and Mary Mcmillan baptised June 18, 1843 (Shortly after this James and Mary left for Ontario, Canada)

1841 Census Jura (actually Uragaig, Colonsay)
Angus Livingston age 60
Margaret Livingston age 55
James Livingston age 25 (b. abt. 1816 or 1815)
Hugh Livingston age 20
Ann Livingston age 15
Jean Livingston age 11
Malcolm McMillan age 25
Christina McMillan age 25
Duncan McMillan age 6 months

Scottish Census 1851
Esknish, Kilmeny Parish, Island of Islay, Argyllshire
John Livingstone age 55 born Mull weaver (His death record indicates he was born abt. 1806 or 1805)
Agnes Livingstone age 54 born Blackburn, Linlithgo
Gavine Livingstone age 16 born Blackburn, Linlithgo apprentice to father
Neil Livingstone age 9 born Colonsay
I would assume from this that Gavin Livingston's 1905 death record is not correct and that JOhn Livingston not James Livingston was his father as indicated in this census. We also have the above mentioned Colonsay, Argyllshire parish records which indicate that Agnes Edmiston was married to John Livingston.
Death Record John Livingstone Cotton and wool weaver died july 6, 1858 Kilmeny Parish, Islay, Argyllshire Parents: ANgus Livingstone CHelsea Pensioner and Margaret McPhail


James Livingston and his wife Mary McMillan left Colonsay shortly after the birth of their daughter Anne in the 1840's and firstly settled in Eldon Township, Victoria County, Ontario Canada and before 1861 are residing in Arthur Township, Wellington County, Ontario where James is interestingly enough also employed as a weaver according to his census records.

1852 Canada West Census (Ontario)
Eldon Township, Victoria County,
James Levingston age 35 b. Scotland Weaver
Mary Levingston age 35 Scotland
Anne Levingston age 10 Scotland
Margaret Levingston age 8 Scotland
Catharine Levingston age 6 Canada
Duncan Levingston age 4 Canada
Mary Levingston age 2 Canada


1881 Ontario, Canada Census
Arthur Township, Wellington County, Ontario
James Livingston age 66 (b. abt. 1815) Weaver Scotland
Mary Livingston age 57 Scotland
Margaret Livingston age 30 Ontario
Mary Livingston age 28 Ontario
Jane Livingston age 26 Ontario
Angus Livingston age 24 Ontario
Sophia Livingston age 16 Ontario
James Livingston age 13 Ontario
Donald Livingston age 9 Ontario
Mary Livingston age 8 Ontario

Note that both John Livingston born abt. 1796 and James Livingston born abt. 1815 or 1816 were both weavers by occupation.

regards,

Donald

[jmlivingstone]

Hi Donald,

I am almost certain there is information somewhere, possibly on this site, that ties links between Colonsay & Islay more closely, I'm seeing familiar names, just not 100% certain where I originally saw them at the moment.

John

[Canadian Livingstone]

hi John,
See above more info on the James Livingston and Mary McMillan who settled firstly in Victoria County, Ontario in the 1840's and then before 1861 in Arthur Township, Wellington County, Ontario.

This ANgus Livingston family is a bit of jigsaw puzzle with a few pieces missing. The 1841 Census from Uragaig, Colonsay I added as before to illustrate the likely connection with those Livingstons in the 1840's Colonsay Parish records to Angus livingston of Uragaig, Colonsay. Doent solve the puzzle however and creates more questions and answers for sure. I just get the sense there is some connection with all these Livingstons recorded on these old parish record pages. Its been a while now but I remember checking out that subsequent Islay connection your talking about. These kin of old Angus by and large I guess left Colonsay in the 1840's either by choice or coerced by economic conditions or by the clearances. I cant help noticing that many of the Livingstons in Western Argyll ie Mull and Morvern and that did remain after the 1840's ended up as paupers particularly the elderly.

regards,

Donald