Hello,
Thought this might be of interest to the Livingston's of Ardnamurchan
"Highland Jacobites 1745"
by Frances McDonnell
John Livingston; Founder, from Ardnamurchan,Argyllshire, McGregor's Glengyle's Regiment. Imprisoned, 15.11.1745 Ardno; 17.12.1745 Dunbarton, liberated 21.8.1747.
Jewel
Angus Livingston and Ann Cameron of Ardnamurchan
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Canadian Livingstone
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Re: Angus Livingston and Ann Cameron of Ardnamurchan
Hi Jewel,
This is the earliest Livingston resident of Ardnamurchan that we have come across so far.
That is something to have found that. I knew our clan served in the local Appin regiment but it would make sense that some might have served with a nearby regiment formed I assume in neighbouring Invernesshire. A highland Livingston of Ardnamurchan origin serving with McGregors in the Glengyle Jacobite regiment. Glengyle is located in the Fort William area in the County of Inverness closely situated to our County of Argyll. Ardnamurchan is adjacent to Morvern Parish where my Livingston's come from and not far from Mull as well. If you have followed the most recent postings of the last couple of weeks we have been contacted by two Livingstons with ancestors who resided in villages in Ardnamurchan Parish in the 1800's. I dont know much about the McGregors who were in the regiment but apparently there is an interesting story about the Mcgregors and Glengyle house. The late Baron Alastair Livingstone's book "No Quarter Given" lists the known highland Livingstons who served in the Appin Regiment of the Appin Stewarts of Western Argyllshire but I was not aware of this Ardnamurchan Livington before in this Glengyle regiment. Ther may have been other highland Livingstons that served in this regiment perhaps. Excellent find. It is a known fact that our Livingstones supported the Jacobite side in 1746 and we have a list of Maclea (Livingston) casualties for the Appin Regiment but no information as to the total number of Livingstons who actually participated as soldiers in the rebellion.
The late Baron Alastair Livingstone's book "No Quarter Given" first published in 1984 also includes this John Livingston of Ardnamurchan in a list of those who served with McGregor of Glengyle as well the Livingstons that served in the Appin regiment of the Appin Stewarts. I have a copy of this book but did not see the highland Livingston with the McGregors, but I noticed tonight that indeed it is in Baron Livingstone's book in the Mcgregor section. I am glad you spotted it from the McDonnell book. It is for a number of reasons an interesting piece of information that I obviously overlooked. John Livingston of Ardnamurchan was obviously one of the lucky ones to have to have not been at the Battle of Culloden and to have survived captivity. Many highland jacobite soldiers were not so fortunate. I suppose he returned to Ardnamurchan. One of the earliest Livingstons at Ardnamurchan I have a record is a John Livingston possibly born around the time of the rebellion who could be a son of this John Livingston but I will not be able to prove that such is the lack of parish records from that early period in Western Argyllshire. This certainly tells us that there were some Livingstons or highland Macleas as they were still apparently generally known as at time located in Ardnamurchan at the time of the Rebellion which is an important piece of information. I would love to have access to the original18th century list that mentions John Livingston of Ardnamurchan and the other Livingstons that served in the Appin
Regiment to solve a mystery.
From another recent forum query we have established that we have a descendant of a James livingston b. 1816 of Colonsay who lived with Angus Livingston and his wife Margaret Hall of Kilfinichen Parish, Ross of Mull and later (Urigaig) Uragaig, Colonsay in 1841 according the 1841 Scottish census who may be related to our regular forum participant John Livingston who is a decendant of Angus Livingston and Margaret Hall. Having done the family history research which seems to suggest a family connection we are hoping that this family connection can be proven through DNA testing. As James Livingston is not included in original list of Kilfinichen baptisms of the children of ANgus Livingston and his Margaret Hall of Kilpatrick and Shiaba, Ross of Mull in the early 1800's so the testing will help to prove whether or not James is the unrecorded son of Angus and Margaret.
Also after going through the original parish records of Livingston in south western Ross of Mull , Kilfinichen Parish, I have reached a point where I can say I reasonably certain that the above mentioned Angus Livingston who lived at kilpatrick and SHIaba, Ross of Mull, Kilfinichen parish in the early 1800's before migrating to nearby Island of Colonsay after 1829 with family is likely the brother of a Donald Livingston b. abt. 1776 at Shiaba, Mull who was married to Cirsty Campbell . I now believe that Donald Livingston abt. 1776 at Shiaba, Ross of Mull and the above mentioned Angus who lived at Shiaba in the early 1800's are the Donald and Angus, sons of Neil Livingston born abt. 1739 all residents of Shiaba, Mull acccording to the 1779 Argyll Census. The final clincher was that for a couple of years both Angus and Margaret Livingston and Donald Livingston and Cirsty Campbell in the early 1800's actually lived at Kilpatrick not far from Shiaba during the same time period. Also this Donald Livingston b. abt. 1776 lived to be quite old and his death record indicated that - you guessed it- his father was none other than a Neil Livingston as I had theorised. So obviously this is yet another situation where Genealogical DNA testing could establish a family connection among families with Western Argyllshire origins.
regards,
Donald
This is the earliest Livingston resident of Ardnamurchan that we have come across so far.
That is something to have found that. I knew our clan served in the local Appin regiment but it would make sense that some might have served with a nearby regiment formed I assume in neighbouring Invernesshire. A highland Livingston of Ardnamurchan origin serving with McGregors in the Glengyle Jacobite regiment. Glengyle is located in the Fort William area in the County of Inverness closely situated to our County of Argyll. Ardnamurchan is adjacent to Morvern Parish where my Livingston's come from and not far from Mull as well. If you have followed the most recent postings of the last couple of weeks we have been contacted by two Livingstons with ancestors who resided in villages in Ardnamurchan Parish in the 1800's. I dont know much about the McGregors who were in the regiment but apparently there is an interesting story about the Mcgregors and Glengyle house. The late Baron Alastair Livingstone's book "No Quarter Given" lists the known highland Livingstons who served in the Appin Regiment of the Appin Stewarts of Western Argyllshire but I was not aware of this Ardnamurchan Livington before in this Glengyle regiment. Ther may have been other highland Livingstons that served in this regiment perhaps. Excellent find. It is a known fact that our Livingstones supported the Jacobite side in 1746 and we have a list of Maclea (Livingston) casualties for the Appin Regiment but no information as to the total number of Livingstons who actually participated as soldiers in the rebellion.
The late Baron Alastair Livingstone's book "No Quarter Given" first published in 1984 also includes this John Livingston of Ardnamurchan in a list of those who served with McGregor of Glengyle as well the Livingstons that served in the Appin regiment of the Appin Stewarts. I have a copy of this book but did not see the highland Livingston with the McGregors, but I noticed tonight that indeed it is in Baron Livingstone's book in the Mcgregor section. I am glad you spotted it from the McDonnell book. It is for a number of reasons an interesting piece of information that I obviously overlooked. John Livingston of Ardnamurchan was obviously one of the lucky ones to have to have not been at the Battle of Culloden and to have survived captivity. Many highland jacobite soldiers were not so fortunate. I suppose he returned to Ardnamurchan. One of the earliest Livingstons at Ardnamurchan I have a record is a John Livingston possibly born around the time of the rebellion who could be a son of this John Livingston but I will not be able to prove that such is the lack of parish records from that early period in Western Argyllshire. This certainly tells us that there were some Livingstons or highland Macleas as they were still apparently generally known as at time located in Ardnamurchan at the time of the Rebellion which is an important piece of information. I would love to have access to the original18th century list that mentions John Livingston of Ardnamurchan and the other Livingstons that served in the Appin
Regiment to solve a mystery.
From another recent forum query we have established that we have a descendant of a James livingston b. 1816 of Colonsay who lived with Angus Livingston and his wife Margaret Hall of Kilfinichen Parish, Ross of Mull and later (Urigaig) Uragaig, Colonsay in 1841 according the 1841 Scottish census who may be related to our regular forum participant John Livingston who is a decendant of Angus Livingston and Margaret Hall. Having done the family history research which seems to suggest a family connection we are hoping that this family connection can be proven through DNA testing. As James Livingston is not included in original list of Kilfinichen baptisms of the children of ANgus Livingston and his Margaret Hall of Kilpatrick and Shiaba, Ross of Mull in the early 1800's so the testing will help to prove whether or not James is the unrecorded son of Angus and Margaret.
Also after going through the original parish records of Livingston in south western Ross of Mull , Kilfinichen Parish, I have reached a point where I can say I reasonably certain that the above mentioned Angus Livingston who lived at kilpatrick and SHIaba, Ross of Mull, Kilfinichen parish in the early 1800's before migrating to nearby Island of Colonsay after 1829 with family is likely the brother of a Donald Livingston b. abt. 1776 at Shiaba, Mull who was married to Cirsty Campbell . I now believe that Donald Livingston abt. 1776 at Shiaba, Ross of Mull and the above mentioned Angus who lived at Shiaba in the early 1800's are the Donald and Angus, sons of Neil Livingston born abt. 1739 all residents of Shiaba, Mull acccording to the 1779 Argyll Census. The final clincher was that for a couple of years both Angus and Margaret Livingston and Donald Livingston and Cirsty Campbell in the early 1800's actually lived at Kilpatrick not far from Shiaba during the same time period. Also this Donald Livingston b. abt. 1776 lived to be quite old and his death record indicated that - you guessed it- his father was none other than a Neil Livingston as I had theorised. So obviously this is yet another situation where Genealogical DNA testing could establish a family connection among families with Western Argyllshire origins.
regards,
Donald
Re: Angus Livingston and Ann Cameron of Ardnamurchan
Hello Donald,
Well I came across this book ,which I purchased several years ago, while I was doing some spring cleaning today, and decided to take a second look. There was only the one Livingston listed. I didn't see any McLea's, the closest was McRae's. In the intro it states : " Due to the Hanoverian government's desire to identify each individual "rebel," court records, jail records, transportation orders and other documents were drawn up, rich in detail. As a result, more particulars on the ordinary man than is generally found are reproduced in the publication."
This book is a dictionary of sorts with all of the names of prisoners. It gives the age of some of the prisoner's with history with each name. Many were sent to Barbados. You know much more of this time period than I, but I was surprised to see many woman taken prisoner including Flora McDonald which has a lengthy piece on her.
If you or anyone is interested on any of the other names I would be happy to post the information given.
The sources given in the book are: PRO, Colonial Office, State Papers, Treasury, SRO, and publications are: Barbados Museum Historical society Journal, Muster roll of Prince Charles Edcward Stuart's Army, (Alistair Livingsstone),Prisoners of the '45 B. Seton(Edinburgh,1929, and List of Persons concerned in the Rebellion 1745-46 Earl of Roseberry.
Jewel
Well I came across this book ,which I purchased several years ago, while I was doing some spring cleaning today, and decided to take a second look. There was only the one Livingston listed. I didn't see any McLea's, the closest was McRae's. In the intro it states : " Due to the Hanoverian government's desire to identify each individual "rebel," court records, jail records, transportation orders and other documents were drawn up, rich in detail. As a result, more particulars on the ordinary man than is generally found are reproduced in the publication."
This book is a dictionary of sorts with all of the names of prisoners. It gives the age of some of the prisoner's with history with each name. Many were sent to Barbados. You know much more of this time period than I, but I was surprised to see many woman taken prisoner including Flora McDonald which has a lengthy piece on her.
If you or anyone is interested on any of the other names I would be happy to post the information given.
The sources given in the book are: PRO, Colonial Office, State Papers, Treasury, SRO, and publications are: Barbados Museum Historical society Journal, Muster roll of Prince Charles Edcward Stuart's Army, (Alistair Livingsstone),Prisoners of the '45 B. Seton(Edinburgh,1929, and List of Persons concerned in the Rebellion 1745-46 Earl of Roseberry.
Jewel
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jmlivingstone
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Re: Angus Livingston and Ann Cameron of Ardnamurchan
Donald/Jewel,
I've had a look on Mull Genealogy & Mull Families, the only Neil any where near the correct dates is as follows;
1. 1779 Census Mull - Neil Livingstone, sons Angus b.abt. 1775 & Donald b. abt. 1777 at Sheabach, Mull.
2. Neil Livingstone, wife Christina Campbell, son - Donald, b.abt. 1776, d. 27.09.1866.
3. 1779 Census Mull, Page 81, Sheabach 17790156.
Livingstone, Neil - 40 yrs. Occupation Gamekeeper.
Livingstone, Angus - 4 yrs.
Livingstone, Donald - 2 yrs.
Neils wife & 4 daughters.
It appears to me, all three Neils above, are probably the same person, there is no Neil of even roughly the same age, any where, on any Mull site I can find, who is close, so I reckon Angus on my side, & Donald were almost certainly brothers, maybe some day, DNA testing will come up with an answer,
John
I've had a look on Mull Genealogy & Mull Families, the only Neil any where near the correct dates is as follows;
1. 1779 Census Mull - Neil Livingstone, sons Angus b.abt. 1775 & Donald b. abt. 1777 at Sheabach, Mull.
2. Neil Livingstone, wife Christina Campbell, son - Donald, b.abt. 1776, d. 27.09.1866.
3. 1779 Census Mull, Page 81, Sheabach 17790156.
Livingstone, Neil - 40 yrs. Occupation Gamekeeper.
Livingstone, Angus - 4 yrs.
Livingstone, Donald - 2 yrs.
Neils wife & 4 daughters.
It appears to me, all three Neils above, are probably the same person, there is no Neil of even roughly the same age, any where, on any Mull site I can find, who is close, so I reckon Angus on my side, & Donald were almost certainly brothers, maybe some day, DNA testing will come up with an answer,
John
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Canadian Livingstone
- Posts: 2773
- Joined: Wed Jul 15, 2009 9:00 pm
Re: Angus Livingston and Ann Cameron of Ardnamurchan
Hi Jewel,
Well hang on your copy of the McDonnell book because according to the publisher it is now out of print and there does not seem to be any used copies out there for sale that I could see. There is another book of McDonnells on Jacobites of North Eastern Scotland that appears to be still available in some book stores but I would not think that would include too much info on Livingston soldiers as there werent generally speaking too many highland Livingstons in North Eastern Scotland in 1745. I have seen the odd Maclea in other Scottish Jacobite regiments. Not all Macleas in Scotland however were Jacobites unlike the highland Maclea Livingstones of Western Argyll who were like Mcleans and Camerons known to be jacobites. I would also reccomend the late Baron Alastair Livingston's book of Jacobite regiments, "No Quarter Given" which includes information on what is known of those Livingstons known to have served with the Appin Regiment of Western Argyll the most famous of which was Donald Livingston 1728-1816 of Morvern. You can probably obtain a copy through Amazon.com or a used copy from a number of used book stores worldwide through Abes books.com where you can find a wide range of Jacobite related history books, new and old.
regards,
Donald
Well hang on your copy of the McDonnell book because according to the publisher it is now out of print and there does not seem to be any used copies out there for sale that I could see. There is another book of McDonnells on Jacobites of North Eastern Scotland that appears to be still available in some book stores but I would not think that would include too much info on Livingston soldiers as there werent generally speaking too many highland Livingstons in North Eastern Scotland in 1745. I have seen the odd Maclea in other Scottish Jacobite regiments. Not all Macleas in Scotland however were Jacobites unlike the highland Maclea Livingstones of Western Argyll who were like Mcleans and Camerons known to be jacobites. I would also reccomend the late Baron Alastair Livingston's book of Jacobite regiments, "No Quarter Given" which includes information on what is known of those Livingstons known to have served with the Appin Regiment of Western Argyll the most famous of which was Donald Livingston 1728-1816 of Morvern. You can probably obtain a copy through Amazon.com or a used copy from a number of used book stores worldwide through Abes books.com where you can find a wide range of Jacobite related history books, new and old.
regards,
Donald
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Canadian Livingstone
- Posts: 2773
- Joined: Wed Jul 15, 2009 9:00 pm
Re: Angus Livingston and Ann Cameron of Ardnamurchan
Hi JOhn,
I am almost certain of it. Finally after looking at a copy of Donald's original death record which states that his father was infact a Neil Livingston, I had little doubt with all of other clues that the information in the original parish records of Donald and Angus Livingston from the early 1800's in Kilfinichen Parish, Ross of Mull provides us the Donald and ANgus who show up in the early 19th century Kilfinichen Parish records of south western Ross of Mull are the sons of Neil Livingston of Shiaba or Shebach of the 1779 Ross of Mull record. Yes I quite agree this is yet another situation where genealogical dna testing could determine whether the descendants of Donald and Angus were related to be absolutely certain. Donald Livingston's death record lists his mother as Christina Campbell but I am wondering if this is a mistake given that we know for a fact that his wife,s name was Cirsty Campbell which is of basically Christina Campbell as well. What are the odds of his wife and mother having the same name. I will ask Donald and Cirsty's descendant about that one. I myself find that a bit of an odd coincidence. Not impossible mind you if Donald's mother and his wife were 2nd cousins or something like that but I am just wondering if Donald;s next of kin got the name of his mother wrong on his death record when he was old man well into his eighties. Anyways cant say whether this is the case or not but I just glad they seem to have got his father Neil correct as it certainly made the theory we are proposing regarding Neil as the son of this Donald and your ancestor Angus alot more conceivalble.
regards,
Donald
I am almost certain of it. Finally after looking at a copy of Donald's original death record which states that his father was infact a Neil Livingston, I had little doubt with all of other clues that the information in the original parish records of Donald and Angus Livingston from the early 1800's in Kilfinichen Parish, Ross of Mull provides us the Donald and ANgus who show up in the early 19th century Kilfinichen Parish records of south western Ross of Mull are the sons of Neil Livingston of Shiaba or Shebach of the 1779 Ross of Mull record. Yes I quite agree this is yet another situation where genealogical dna testing could determine whether the descendants of Donald and Angus were related to be absolutely certain. Donald Livingston's death record lists his mother as Christina Campbell but I am wondering if this is a mistake given that we know for a fact that his wife,s name was Cirsty Campbell which is of basically Christina Campbell as well. What are the odds of his wife and mother having the same name. I will ask Donald and Cirsty's descendant about that one. I myself find that a bit of an odd coincidence. Not impossible mind you if Donald's mother and his wife were 2nd cousins or something like that but I am just wondering if Donald;s next of kin got the name of his mother wrong on his death record when he was old man well into his eighties. Anyways cant say whether this is the case or not but I just glad they seem to have got his father Neil correct as it certainly made the theory we are proposing regarding Neil as the son of this Donald and your ancestor Angus alot more conceivalble.
regards,
Donald
Re: Angus Livingston and Ann Cameron of Ardnamurchan
Hi Donald,
Well isn't that interesting, I guess I better take care of my McDonnell book, I purchased it 4 or 5 years ago. I also have a copy of Baron Alastair Livingstone's book "No Quarter Given", which is very helpful also.
Jewel
Well isn't that interesting, I guess I better take care of my McDonnell book, I purchased it 4 or 5 years ago. I also have a copy of Baron Alastair Livingstone's book "No Quarter Given", which is very helpful also.
Jewel
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Canadian Livingstone
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- Joined: Wed Jul 15, 2009 9:00 pm
Re: Angus Livingston and Ann Cameron of Ardnamurchan
Hi John,
I will say this.
Our ancestors may have lost their meager tenant holdings in Western Argyll, most of them dispersed to the far corners of the earth and the old clan system long since broken but I still see in the present day Livingstones that contact this forum a close connection to Clan Livingstone and their highland roots that remains undiminished by time and by history.
regards,
Donald
I will say this.
Our ancestors may have lost their meager tenant holdings in Western Argyll, most of them dispersed to the far corners of the earth and the old clan system long since broken but I still see in the present day Livingstones that contact this forum a close connection to Clan Livingstone and their highland roots that remains undiminished by time and by history.
regards,
Donald
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Kyle MacLea
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Re: Angus Livingston and Ann Cameron of Ardnamurchan
Amen, Donald!
Kyle=
Kyle=
Kyle S. MacLea
Clan Society Life Member; DNA Project Co-Admin
New Hampshire, USA
kyle -dot- maclea -at- gmail -dot- com
Clan Society Life Member; DNA Project Co-Admin
New Hampshire, USA
kyle -dot- maclea -at- gmail -dot- com
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Roberta Ann
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Re: Angus Livingston and Ann Cameron of Ardnamurchan
Hi Donald;
Yes, and very well said Amen.
May I also say Happy St. Patricks day to all our Irish Cousins and friends near and far.
Regards;
Roberta Ann Livingstone
Yes, and very well said Amen.
May I also say Happy St. Patricks day to all our Irish Cousins and friends near and far.
Regards;
Roberta Ann Livingstone