by Canadian Livingstone » Mon Jan 08, 2018 7:02 pm
Hi Bill,
I am not certain at the moment where you would find info on Livingston residence or residences croft or crofts at Drumnatain.
Drimnatain. There were actually a few families that lived in the first half of the 1800's at Drimnatain contrary to what you may have thought and actually other related LIvingstons besides your ancestor Neil Livingston including an apparently an elderly Uncle of Neil Livingstons living in an neighbouring croft at least in 1851. Later an Ordnance Survey done of Kilochspelvie Parish indicates that only one croft remains and some ruins suggesting that most or all of the tenants at Drimnatain were cleared by their landlord before 1868-1878 period. You may not be aware but census info suggests that Neil Livingston left Drimnatyne sometime between 1851 and 1861 but I don't know whether or not did so voluntarily or was cleared from the croft at Drimnatyne. Tomorrow I hope to take a closer look at the original 1861 Census and see if all Livingstons and other tenants were removed from Drimnatyne by 1861 and if anyone remained.
The proprietor of the property at Drimnatain was in the 1860's I found out a M. G. Maclaine ( Murdoch Gilean Maclaine 1845-1901) son of the 22th Mclaine of Lochbuie Donald Mclaine and this land was owned for centuries by the Maclaines of nearby Lochbuie. THeir ancient original ancestral home was Castle Moy and later they built and lived in Lochbuie House. For a good part of his life I suspect that Murdoch Gilean Mclaine was an absentee landlord not living in Kilochspelvie Parish but is see that by the later part of the 1800's he and his wife were residing in Kinlochspelvie Parish. Anyways this Drimnatain on which your Maclea/Livingstons resided on perhaps for some time, was likely for centuries held by the McLaines of Lochbuie. The 1851 census info for Angus Livingston age 88 who was a neighbour of your ancestor Neil and likely his elderly Uncle indicates that old Angus was actually born somewhere else apparently in Torosay other than Kinlochspelvie Parish, but the parish is not listed in the 1851 Census info on old Angus. So I think we can assume that he and his likely his brother Duncan Jr. your ancestor were born elsewhere in an unknown location in Torosay, Mull.
Good news. I think I have found quite a bit more on your Livingston family that I will slowly get around to explaining beginning in this message and the next couple of messages that will give you a better idea of just who was living at Drimnatain in the first half of the 1850's and will probably be a surprise to you.
Neil Livingston's census info
This is what I have for census info for Neil Livingston. He appears to have left the croft at Drimnatain sometime between 1851 and 1861.
1841 Census Kilochspelvie Parish, Torosay, Mull
Niel Levingston
Drimnatain
Niel Levingston age 45
Mary age 40
James age 15
Duncan age 12
Alex age 9
Robert age 5
Mary age 2
1851 Census Kilochspelvie Parish Torosay, Mull
Drimnatain
Nill Livingston 55 agricultural labourer born Kilochspelvie parish
Mary 53
Donald 23 (1828)
Alexander 18
Robert 14
Mary 11
Nill 8
1861 Census Kilochspelvie Parish, Torosay, Mull
Location: Castle Roy? (Should this read Castle Moy area?)
Neil Livingston age 65
Mary age 63
Alexander age 27
Neil age 17
1871 Census Kilochspelvie Parish, Torosay, Mull
Castle Roy? (Should this read Castle Moy area?)
Neil Livingston 78
Mary Livingston 76
1881 Census Kinlochspelvie Parish, Torosay, Mull
now residing in Croggan village no. 1
Neil Livingston widower age 88 retired farmer
Please note Other Livingstons however lived at Drimnatain prior to 1841 according to the Kinlochspelvie parish records that I assume are kin to Neil's father Duncan Livingston. You see these other Livingstons better if I show you the early parish records for the livingstons in the Drimnatain area in the early 1800's and late 1700's according to the Parish records.
In the late 1700's and early 1800's it appears that two brothers Duncan Livingston who was married to Catharine Mcdougall and Angus Livingston who was married to Mary McPhadden resided in Drimnatyne. The one brother Duncan Livingston your ancestor died apparently in Drimnatyne sometime before 1841 but his brother Angus born back in 1762 or 1763 lived a long life in Drimnatyne in the 1851Scottish census he is 88 years old retired agricultural labourer living with his son Angus Livingston Jr. at Drimnatyne. Old Angus Livingston Sr. born in 1762 or 1763 would then be I believe your ancestor Neil Livingston's Uncle also residing in Drimnatyne in 1851 according to the 1851. Old Angus Sr. then died a few years later in 1856 at the age of 94 according to his death record. The luck in finding that death record is that it lists his parents as farmer Duncan Livingston and his wife Sarah McPhadden. Thus as of today I believe I have found the name of the parents of both this Angus Livingston Sr. b. 1762 and his brother Duncan Livingston your ancestor and father of Neil Livingston. See below where I recorded the two apparent Livington brothers and their children as indicated in the parish records. It is clear from the parish records of their children that both your ancestor Duncan Livingston and his family and this Angus Livingston Sr and his family lived in the late 1700's and early 1800's in Drimnatyne and this apparent brother of Duncan who was apparently Angus Livingston Sr. of Drimnnatyne lived well into his nineties. I think I have taken your Livingston family back one more generation. More on that tomorrow.
Livingston Family no. 1 of Drimnatain circa early 1800's
Duncan Livingston b. 1760's? and Catharine Mcdougal of Drimnatyne,Killochspelvie Parish
1. Angus Livingston b. March 13, 1794 Drimnatyne
2. Niel Livingston born December 5, 1795 born at Drimnatyne,kinlochspelvie Parish, Mull
3. Mary Livingston b. March 17, 1798 Drimnatyne
also entries for a Duncan Livingston and Nelly Mcdougal could be the same family a Duncan Livingston and Catharine Mcdougal
John Livingston b. 18/01/1804 Drimnatyne
Alexander Livingston b. 13/05/1804 Drimnatyne
Son Neil's family later at Drimnatain croft in 1820's
Neil/Niel Livingston b. 1795 and Mary Mclaine/Mclean of Drimnatyne, Torosay and Kilochsplelvie Parish, Mul
married Feb 2, 1821
Known Children and their birth records
1. Catharine Livingston b. February 14, 1822 Drimnatyne
2. Janet Livingston b. November 1, 1823 Drimnatyne
3. Duncan Livingston b. October 3, 1825 Drimnatyne
4. Donald Livingston b. January 1, 1828 Drimnatyne
Livingston Family no. 2 of Drimnatyne, Kilochspelvie parish, Mull circa early 1800's
Angus Livingston b. 1762 d. March 16, 1856 Drimnatyne and Marrion Mcfadden or McPhadden
1. John Livingston 18/04/1797 Drimnatyne
2. Gilbert Livingston 23/05/1799 Drimnatyne
3. Mary Livingston 20/07/1801 Drimnatyne
3. Niel Livingston 10/11/1803 Drimnatyne
4.Margaret Livingston 03/07/1806 Drimnatyne
5. Anne Livingston 03/08/1812 Drimnatyne
6. Angus Livingston precise birth date unknown (elderly father lived with him and his wife Ann Mcdougal in Drimnatain)
John Livingston b. abt. 1786? and Mary Mcdougal of Drimnatyne[/b] (son of Angus?)
1. b. 28/11/1814 Drimnatyne
2. Allan Livingston b. 15/11/1815 Drimnatyne
3. Donald Livingston b. 19/12/1817 Drimnatyne
regards,
Donald