My Livingstone Line

[Torrie20]

Hi, I have been researching my Livingstone ancestors but am now unsure where to go. This is what I know

Me

Parents

Grandparents

John W. Simpson
Beatrice Livingstone(b. 1887) (siblings include Isabella, Duncan, Alex, Peter, John, Janet, Catherine and Allan-all born in Portbannatyne, Bute, Scotland) Beatrice and many of her siblings emigrated to Canada to start their families.

Duncan Livingstone (b. 1833-Morven, Argyle, Scotland, died 1909 Portbannatyne)
Elizabeth (Eliza) McBride (1857-1927)

Allan Livingstone (b. 1795-Lanark, Lanarkshire, Scotland, died 1867-Kildavaig Scotland)
Janet McInnes (b. 1801-1855)
-this couple and their children are listed on this website under Morvern Births, for interests sake

Duncan Livingstone
Mary Cameron
-this is where I am stuck, I know nothing about this couple (my g-g-g-g-grandparents) but their names.
-any suggestions on where to find information, next steps etc would be greatly appreciated!

thanks!
torrie : )

[Kyle MacLea]

Welcome, Torrie! I hope we'll be able to come up with some good ideas for you!

In the mean time, welcome to our humble Forum. Enjoy your stay and come back often!

Kyle=

[Canadian Livingstone]

Hi Torrie,

Yes you are indeed a descendant of Herring Fisherman Duncan Livingston and Elizbeth (Betsy) McBride and Duncan's Parents Allan Livingston b. abt. 1796 and Janet McInnes b. 1801 of Lochaline, Morvern Parish. And yes it appears that Allan's mother was named Mary and she was born according to the 1841 Scottish Census way back in 1751. Beyond that I have no information on Mary or her husband. Regretably those detailed Scottish census records do not begin before 1841. There is a 1779 list of Argyll tenants that includes some Morvern residents but the Morvern section does not give a detailed family breakdown and in any event it is before Allan was born. It may list tenant farmers who resided at Lochaline which might be of interest though we cant be certain your family lived at Lochaline in 1779 in any event. There is a very good chance that your ancestors lived in Morvern Parish for some time but unfortunately no detailed records of any help prior to the early 1800's for those searching for their Morvern ancestors.

Although Duncan moved around a bit after his marriage to Elizabeth living for a time in Kilfinan Parish, Argyll, Cadder, Lanarkshire and later North Bute Parish, Bute he is clearly of Morvern Parish origin according to the census records. Does his 1833 baptismal record state his family lived at Lochaline at the time of his baptism? He and his father originate in Morvern Parish I presume from the census info and lived at Lochaline. My great-great-great grandfather Miles Livingston b.1775 is also a native of Morvern Parish though the Parish records seem to indicate he was born on the neighbouring Island of Lismore. He came to Canada in 1812 settling briefly at Lord Selkirks Red River Colony with his son Donald Livingston and another boatbuilder Donald Livingston also a Morvern native and likely a cousin.

It is I am sorry to say an almost impossible task you face to find information on Allan Livingstone's parents unless you locate a detailed cemetery stone since Morvern Parish records for period of Allan's birth are unfortunately missing. The Morvern Parish records that have survived only the cover the period beginning in the early 1800's so one is pretty much out of luck for baptisms or marriage record info prior to that as far a individuals that resided in Morvern Parish are concerned.

[Roberta Ann]

Hi Torrie;

All I could find was a daughter, of Duncan Livingstone and Mary Cameron, Mary b. Dec. 1792, Lanark, Lanarkshire. Mary married Donald Stewart June 24, 1813 in Kilmichael, Glassary, Argyll.

Allan and Janet were married April 5, 1827 in Morvern.

I agree with Donald about the records, however, I will take another look tomorrow.

Regards;

Roberta

[Canadian Livingstone]

Hi Torrie,

I could not locate a marriage record in the Morvern records for Allan Livingston and Janet McInnis in the 1820's. I noticed that there is a birth record for your ancestor their son Duncan b. July 2,1833 at Lochaline in Morvern Parish. This is of course where the family is located in the 1841 Scottish Census. The most famous Morvern Parish son was Donald Livingston 1728-1816 of Savary, Morvern son of John Livingston and Ann McInnis. There were a number of Livingston and McInnis families that lived in close proximity to each at Savary and it could be that your Livingston and McInnis ancestors are connected to Savary. It was Donald whom while serving in the Appin Regiment during the Battle of Culloden in 1746 rescued the Appin Regiment banner after the last standard bearer had fallen on the battlefield and subsequently returned it to the Appin Stewarts.

Allan and Janet's daughter Catharine was born in 1829 at Knock in Morvern Parish so perhaps the family had some earlier connection there. I am not familiar with Knock but there was a Knock Park and Knock House in the 1800's at Lochline so that could be a place in the same area as Lochline in Morvern Parish. I wish I could consult the late Donald McInnis of Cumbernauld as he was born in Morvern and he was always a great source information on Morvern. At one time he had been the President or Vice President of the Clan McInnis Society but was quite interested in Donald Livingston (1728-1816) of Savary Morvern on account of the fact that Donald's mother had been of Clan McInnis. Clan McInnis were one of the old families at Morvern along with McGillverays and McLeans and of course Mclea Livingstones. You will notice in the Morvern parish records that a number of Clan McInnis married Livingstons. I understood from Donald McInnis that both the famous Donald Livingston's mother and wife were of Clan McInnis.

regards,

Donald

[Canadian Livingstone]

Hi Torrie,

I noticed an error in our Maclea Livingstone Society records for Morvern Parish on the web page. We have Patrick Livingston as being born Feb. 2, 1828 a son of Allan Livingston and Catharine McInnes. I checked the original parish record and this Patrick Livingston born in 1828 is recorded in the original records as the eldest son of your ancestors Allan Livingston and Janet McInnis. This is also evident in the 1841 Census where we see your ancestor Allan Livingston b.1796 and his wife Janet McInnis b.1801 with their children, Patrick, Catharine, Duncan, Alexander, John and Mary. There was oddly enough another Allan Livingston listed in the Morvern Parish records at Knock in the Lochline area who was married to a Katharine McInnis and who according to the baptism records had Ann b.1817, Janet b.1824, Angus b.1829. There is also a Neil Livingston b.1827 apparently with this family but I did not locate him in my search. Anyways I thought you might come across these two Allan Livingstons who both married into the McInnis family and thought I would sort this all out to prevent any future confusion and identify one error. I would assume your ancestor Allan Livingston and his wife Janet McInnis married sometime before Patrick was born in 1828 but I have had no luck finding a marriage record. Roberta however has found a marriage for your Allan and Janet in 1827 which probably is the one recorded I subsequently noticed in the FHL IGI. For some strange reason my source did not include your ancestors marriage record.

Morvern Parish Feb. 8th 1828 Allan Livingston Crofter ``Knock`` and Janet MacInnes Patrick Livingston

So from this we can determine that your family lived at Knock as far back as the birth of their first child. I have some familiarity with the names of most Morvern villages but I dont know much about this Knock except that it seems to be in the vicinity of Lochaline. Hopefully we can find out a little more about Knock and Lochaline in the future.

The 1841 Census indicates that that in addition to Allan and Janet at Lochaline Village, Morvern Parish there appears to have been a brother John b. abt. 1786 apparently single and a elderly widowed mother Mary born abt. 1751 or 1750. I also noticed living elsewhere in Lochaline Village two widows and their children. One was Mary Livingston b. abt. 1791 and a Catharine Livingston b. abt. 1781. I was not able to determine whom their husbands had been or if were brothers of Allan and John.


regards,

Donald

[Bachuil]

Knoc is often a mistake for Cnoc meaning hill.

[beadmom]

Hi Torrie,

Welcome.

You won't find a more friendly knowledgeable or dedicated group of Livingstone hunters anywhere else.

I had a lot of fun and learned a lot about our family name and history reading the information available here.

Ginger Livingston Sanders

[Torrie20]

hello all!

Thank you for your great input...it is wonderful that many of you are so familiar with the area and parishes.

I live in Canada so your information is greatly appreciated!!!

It sounds like it will be very difficult if at all possible to find the next generation in my family, which is disappointing but not surprising.

On a side note...my family like many I'm sure have passed down through the generations that we are related to Dr. David Livingstone.

It was my understanding that Dr. David L's father was Neil Livingstone and grandfather was Neil Livingstone as well...this information can be found at this site...http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.anc ... /index.htm

However here on this site it lists Neil as a great grandfather of David and his grandfather as Donald and father as Neil...can anyone clear this up for me?

Thank you again for all your great information!!! Hopefully in the future I will be able to visit Scotland and Morvern!

Torrie

[Canadian Livingstone]

Hi Torrie,

A great many Livingstons have family stories connecting them to Dr. Livingstone's family. Most of them I am afraid are not related. There are a couple of stories as to who Dr. Livingstone's great grandfather was. Dr. Livingstone in his autobiography states that his great grandfather was a Jacobite soldier in Bonnie Prince Charle's Army and was killed at the Battle of Culloden April 16th 1746. He does not unfortunately provide us with any futher details on his great-grandfather such as his first name. I suspect his name was John Livingston as Dr. Livingstone's eldest brother was named John for some reason by his father Neil whose own father was also named Neil. Also Dr. Livingstone's Uncle John Livingston b.1777 was the eldest son of his grandfather Neil Livingston and his grandmother Mary Morrison so I taking a flying leap and speculating that there is reason why the first son in two family generations was named John. If my father or grandfather died in one of the most historic battles in Scottish history chances are I would name my first son after him. Anyways that just my speculation getting the better of me. There was a John Livingston of Ballachulish Estate in the Appin Regiment and there is a story that Dr. Livingstone's ancestors lived at Ballachulish before his grandfather lived at Mull and the neighbouring Isle of Ulva. There is a tradition that there were several generations of John Mcleas (Livingstones) at Ballachulish. Unfortunatley Dr. Livingstone makes no mention of his family living at Ballachulish before Mull and the Isle of Ulva. So my theory if I can call it that is very speculative at best.

The other story was that Dr. Livingston's great-grandfather was Neil Livingstone the youngest son of a Baron Livingstone of Bachuil. This son however was not apparently killed at Culloden so there may be a problem with either this scenario or with Dr. Livingstone's memory. Though some have challenged Dr. Livingstone on this one, I would find it hard to believe that Dr. Livingstone would be confused as to fate of his great grandfather given that he spent so much time as a boy with his grandfather Neil Livingstone whom he tells us in his book was the family storyteller and a religious man. Seems unlikely that his grandfather would make up a story that his father was at Culloden and Dr. Livingstone would be deceived as to the truth. ANd if his great-grandfather had been the son of a Baron of Bachuil he would almost certainly have mentioned his family line as being from such an ancient and historic family line. Indeed it is believed Dr. Livingstone knew of the Bachuil Livingstones and met the Baron of Bachuil upon one of his returns to Scotland, but he mentions no ancestral connection in his biography or any of his correspondence. Instead he only mentions in his book only that his Livingston ancestors originated from the Isle of Ulva near Mull. On one of his return visits he took a sailing ship to Mull and the Isle of Ulva in search of any kin remaining, but evidently all of his Livingston relatives had by the mid 19th century long since left for the lowlands or the colonies and his quest was to no avail apparently. From time to time however we get stories from Livingstones or Livingstons with accounts of some family connection and we try to check them out.

Dr. Livingstone had sons but his sons had no sons and there is no direct male Livingstone descendant today. There are of course descendants of his daughters such as David Livingstone Wilson a great-grandson of the Doctor and and a grandson of his daughter Annie Wilson. Dr. Livingstone's brother Reverend Charles Wilson briefly joined him in Africa and lived in the United States. He had one son who died young so there are male Livingstones descended from that family line either. Dr. Livingstone's eldest brother John Livingstone (1811-1899) expressed no interest in being a missionary or a doctor like his brother, but he helped his brother financially with his education. The two were apparently close and Dr. Livingstone corresponded with his older brother John while he was exploring Africa. Among the personal effects Stanley brought back with him as proof he had located the missing missionary doctor was a letter addressed to his brother John Livingstone of Listowel, Ontario, Canada. Dr. Livingstone's brother had left Lanarkshire a few years after his famous brother had left for Africa in 1840 and he and his wife Sarah MacKenzie and their children settled first in Lanark County, Ontario and later in the town of Listowel where John prospered as a merchant. John had a large family and from this Livingstone family there are a number of Livingstone descendants known residing in Canada and possibly in the United States today descended from John and his wife Sarah Mackenzie.

As for descendants of Doctor Livingstone's Uncle's it is not as clear. The uncles of Doctor Livingston were said by his brother John Livingstone to have been John, Charles, Donald and Duncan. There is some question as to whether there was Uncle named Donald but his brother John when asked as elderly man in the 1890's included a Donald. It is known for certain by early biographers from the family that one of the Uncle's Charles Livingston died at sea during the Napoleonic War. There is some suggestion that other died during the Napoleonic was and it is known that all of the sons of Dr. Livingstone's grandparents Neil Livingstone and Mary Morrison served in the military during the Napoleonic War except for the father Neil Livingstone who at one time worked at the Blantyre woolen mill and later made a living as tea merchant. His brother Charles had impressed the owners of the Woolen Mill and landed an office position with them unfortunately he ended up pressed into service of the Royal Navy during the Napoleonic Wars and sadly never returned to his family in Blantyre near Glasgow. The fate of the other Uncles of Dr. Livingstones remains ultimately a mystery to me though some have suggested having possible family connections to them. Did any of them survive the Napoleonic Wars and if so what happened to them?

regards,

Donald