New member seeking some direction.

[Canadian Livingstone]

Hi Alex,
In addition to there being two distinct Islay Livingston families in Nottawasaga and in Medonte in the 1800's there
Appear to be at least two Livingston familes in two old cemeteries in Nottawasaga though it seems likely they are infact related.
There seems to be two pioneer cemeteries in Nottawasaga with old Livingstons in them actually. West Nottawasaga Presbyterian contains the grave site of
Alexander Livingston and his wife Flora Lamont (ALexander listed as born abt. 1815 in 1891 Nottawasaga Township, Ontario Census
Angus Livingston husband of Elizabeth McDermid
Mrs Angus Livingston (Elizabeth McDermid daughter of Duncan and Rebecca McDermid)
son Angus
son Captain Alex D. Livingston

Duntroon Pioneer Cemetery
Malcolm Livingston and Mary Lamont I think this is the Malcolm Livington that was an early schoolteacher at Duntroon.
sons
ANgus
archibald
Neil

The only Stanley Livingston I could find in the census records was the son of Angus Livingston and Elizaberth McDermid that are buried in the West Nottawasaga Presbyterian Cemetery. Stanley is listed in the 1901 Census posted in a previous message. Does this sound like your family? If your family is buried at Duntroon then it must be the other family listed.

regards,

Donald

[Canadian Livingstone]

Hi ALex,

Still trying to sort out the Mendonte Township Livingstons and the Nottawasaga Livingstons for my own records. There are a couple of things I am trying to figure out.
1. When did your ancestor Alexander Livingston father of Angus or his father first take up settlement in Nottawasaga Township. THere are no Livingstons recorded in the 1837 Directory Listing of original families on lots in Nottawasaga Township so it likely was after 1837 and before the 1861 Census where he is listed as a resident in that township.

2. The 1837 Directory lists Neil Livingston (1788-1871) who was married to FLora Gilchrist as located at that early time on Concession 9 Lot 7 Oro Township. Oro Township is adjacent to Mendonte township and many of the Islay scottish families that settled in Oro and took up residence in neighbouring Mendonte Township which seems precisely what Neil Livingston of Islay, Scotland did as I find him in the 1861 Census with wife Flora Gilchrist. So this makes sense that he would be early on in Oro Township and later in MEdonte township. The only question remains is this your Nottawasaga ancestor ALexander's father as some family historians seem to have thought or is he the father of Alexander Livingston age 49 in the 1861 Census Medonte Township. This mystery is perplexing and this needs to sorted out but perhaps some tangible clues can be found amongst the land records and with the local historians.

regards,

Donald

[Roberta Ann]

Hi Donald and Alex.;

Addendum:-

Neil Livingston married Flora Gilchrist Aug. 27, 1810

Children born Kilarrow
Alexander baptised, Avinvogie, May 23, 1811
Bell-----------"-------, Gartnatra, July 14, 1813
Duncan-------"-------, New Cottage, Sept. 21, 1815
James--------"-------, New Cottage, Sept. 23, 1817
Mary----------``-----, Gartnatra, Feb. 5, 1822
Mary----------``-----,Gartnatra, Nov. 8, 1824
Ronald--------``-----, Gartnatra, March 23, 1827
Janet---------"-------, Gartnatra,Aug. 29, 1829

Regards;

Roberta

[Canadian Livingstone]

Hi Roberta,

Thanks for that.
Neil Livingston and Flora Gilchrist lived in the Hamlet of Gortnatra in Kilarrow Parish, Isle of Islay before settling in Oro and subsequently neighbouring Mendonte Township,Simcoe County. THis info will be useful if any of any descendants of these Medonte TOwnship, Livingstons contact us in the future. It seems clear now that ALex who contacted the forum is connected to the Nottawasaga Livingstons and not the Medonte Township Livingstons. Glad however that these Simcoe County Livingstons are beginning to make sense. There is another group of Livingstons that lived in Vespra Township, Simcoe County as well but Alexander of Nottawasaga is the challenge at hand.

Medonte Township, Simcoe County 1861 Ontario Census

Neil Livingston age 70 (This is obviously Neil Livingston and Flora Cameron that were married 1810 as you mentioned at Kilarrow Parish, Isle of Islay)
Flora age 68
Ronald age 30 son

Alexander Livingston age 49 b. abt. 1812 or 1811
Martha age 34
(all of the same page of Census page 29)
James Livingston age 41 b. abt. 1820 or 1819 (Page 27)
Catharine age 34
Looks like this could be the actuall family of Neil Livingston and Flora Gilchrist residing in Mendonte Twp not Nottawasaga.
I think this above mentioned ALexander may be Neil and Flora Gilchrist's son and not the Alexander in Nottawasaga who seems to be born more like abt 1815 and is Alex's ancestor. Some of the earlier family researchers may have been as confused about this as I was. But not 100 percent certain and I wish I could be more certain. I going to have to at some point take a closer look at the land records for Nottawasaga and try to figure when Alex's ancestor first acquired his farm in Nottawasaga Township. It was sometime before 1861 but after the 1837 Directory recorded the landowner of Nottawasaga. No Livingtons listed in Nottawasaga at that early date. Livingstons did however settle in the 1830's in Oro and neibhouring Mendonte Township near Craighurst. We have Neil Livingston in Oro Township and a Dougal Livingston in Mendonte Township by 1837. Neil later settled in neighbouring Medonte where he is living before 1861.

There is also an Alexander born abt. 1815 in the parish records of Kilmeny Parish, Isle of Islay that is closer in age to Alexander Livingston of Nottawasaga Township, Simcoe County but I not certain that is him by any means. As you can see from this and my previous posts that we actually have two Alexander Livingstons in Simcoe County, Ontario both likely of Islay origin but only one son can be the son of Neil Livingstone and Flora Gilchrist of Kilarrow Parish, Island of Islay and later Oro and Mendonte townships, Simcoe County. Also people should bear in mind that Nottawasaga Township I think in the Collingwood vincinity while Oro and Mendonte Township are closer to Craighurst and Edgar area. So there is a little bit of distance between Oro/Mendonte townships and Nottawasaga so there is a possibility that they are not the same families though there is every possibility coming from Islay as I think they all did they might have some family connection close or more distant. The local history in both Oro/Mendonte townships and Nottawasaga mentions a significant influx of Scottish Isle of Islay families, Curries, Lamonts, Galbreiths, Gilchrist etc and Livingstons among others. I do think I will have to eventually go into the alphabetical land index for Nottawasaga Township in Simcoe County, locate which lot and concession number in Nottawasaga where Alex's ancestor ALexander had his farm and trace the history of the deeds. From there we could a better sense of when Alexander b.abt. 1815 acquired the property and if another Livingston owned it before him. The original deed of Alexanders might also indicate what township he lived in if he lived in an other township before he acquired the lot in Nottawasaga Township. At the very least a check of the deed index will tell us when he or his family first located in Nottawasaga Township. The 1837 Home District Directory at least states there were no Livingston landowners in 1837 in Nottawasaga so that seems to suggest that ALexander and any other Livingstons may have arrived in Nottawasaga after the 1830's settlement of Islay folk perhaps indicating that they initially settled in another township in Simcoe County or perhaps arrived later in the County. Anyways need to do a little more digging to sort this out.

regards,

Donald

[Canadian Livingstone]

Hi Roberta,
Getting back to the Nottawasaga Livingstons
The 1861 Census for Nottawasaga Township, Simcoe County indicates two Livingston householders born in the early 1800's and one elder Livingston householder born in the 1790's who was a Schooteacher. From the Cemetery records I discovered that both Malcolm and Alex's descendant married Lamonts. I wonder if they were sisters or cousins? And more reason to wonder if Malcolm and ALexander were brothers themselves. So many questions that need to be answered. Oh well I like a challenge. By the way Malcolm Livingston and his wife Mary Lamont are buried at Duntroon in the Pioneer cemetery there and ALex's ancestor ALexander Livingston born abt. 1815 aaccording to the 1891 Census and his his wife FLora Lamont is buried in West Nottawasaga Presbyterian Cemetery. I would like to also look Alexander's death record. Presumingly he died sometime after 1891. Perhaps Alex has that info already if not perhaps that is another thing to check out. UNfortnately his death record wont list the name of his parents. The annoying thing about Ontario death records is that the parents of the deceased werent recorded on the form until around World War I as I recall unlike the Scottish death records which record the names of parent from the year 1855.

Nottawasaga Township 1861

Malcolm Livingston age 42 born abt. 1819
Mary age 23 (Lamont)
Mary age 4
Donald age 1

Donald Livingston age 65 schooteacher

In a different part of Nottawasaga Township
Alexander Livingston age 44 abt. 1817 ( in 1871 b. abt. 1816 in 1891 Alexander is recorded as being born abt. 1815)
Flora age 39 (Lamont)
Catharine age 16
Neil age 14
Angus age 12
Archibald age 10
Samuel age 8
Malcolm age 6
Anne age 1
Flora and Mary Lamont are sisters daughters of Samuel Lamont born in Kilarrow Parish, Islay

Now oddly enough the other Alexander Livingston who was born in the early 1800's on the Isle of Islay, Argyllshire was Alexander Livingston born March 18,1815 Storkaig, Kilmeny Parish Isle of Islay and by strange coincidence he had a brother named Malcolm born October 27 1819. This Alexander and Malcolm were the sons of Neil Livingston and Catharine Lamond or Lamont of Kilmeny Parish. No marriage record for them.Now I would think that this could be the parents of the ALexander and Malcolm of Nottawasaga Township but I am still not certain how that Donald Livingston from the 1790's connects with Malcolm and would like to do some more research on these two Livingston families in Nottawasaga before coming to any final conclusions. Kinda a work in progress for the time being. This one as you can see is a bit tricky and I want to avoid jumping to any conclusions regarding ALex or Malcolm's parentage. I am pretty certain they are all from the Island of Islay and connected one way or another to settler influx from the Isle of Islay, Scotland that commenced in 1833/1834 to Simcoe County, Ontario. So in regard to Alex Livingstons original question as where his ancestors came from I am almost completely his Livingston family roots at least from the late 1700's early 1800s are with Livingstons that lived an worked on the Island of Islay. Before that though it would be difficult to trace they likely originated like my Islay Livingstons from Mull or Morvern in Argyllshire.

regards,

Donald

[Canadian Livingstone]

Hi ALex,

Your Uncle has provided me with the family tree and I am hoping to locate Concession no. and Lot number where Alexander Livington b.1815 first settled in Nottawasaga Township and if Malcolm Livingston born abt. 1819 and Catharine Livingston born 1790's farmer and Donald Livingston Schoolteacher born 1796 are related. I can probably find out a little more in terms of when they first settled in Nottawasaga though it may be more difficult to establish whether or not they are related. If I get a chance I will check out early 19th century land records and wills pertaining to the Nottawasaga Township Livingstons of the 1800's.

regards

Donald

[Canadian Livingstone]

Hi ALex,

I am passing this info on to you and your Uncle Robert.

1. There was some land grant info regarding the "other" Simcoe County Livingstones Neil Livingstone who was married Flora Gilchrist and Dougall Livingstone both presumingly from Islay, Neil coming from Kilarrow Parish, Islay.They each received a free land grant from the Government of Upper Canada in the year 1832. Neil Livingstone received a grant of land at Con.9 Lot 7 Oro Township and Dougall Livingstone received a land grant at Medonte Township Concession 11 Lot 6. Perhaps Neil and Dougall were brothers or related in some way but I dont know that for certain. Later old Neil Livingstone and his wife Flora Gilchrist left Oro Township and ended up sometime before the 1861 Census residing with son Ronald Livingston on his land grant Concession 12 Lot 6 Medonte Township it would seem from the 1861 Census. Because old Neil and Dougall Livingstone lived in very close proximity to each other one might suspect they were brothers or some sort of kin back in Kilarrow Parish Islay.

2. The land grant info suggests that your ancestor Alexander Livingston b.1815 did not receive any land in Ontario or Simcoe County as a free grant in the 1830's, 1840's or 1850's in the form of a land grant from the Government of Upper Canada as some Scottish settlers did in Simcoe County in the 1830's. And the Home District Census of 1837 indicates that no Livingston was landowner in Nottawasaga Township by 1837. Therefore my assumption would be that Alexander purchased his lot in Nottawasaga County in the 1840's or 1850's from an original owner. The next step then is to try and determine through a Nottawasaga land abtract index and land records precisely when this land transaction took place. The good news is that in the 1861 Agricultural Census for Nottawasaga Township and the 1871 Nottawasaga Township Census indicate that your ancestor Alexander Livingston's farm was located on Concession 12 lot 24 just a little south west of the town of Collingwood, Ontario. Your Uncle Rob was not certain of the precise location but I looked it up today. The other Livingston who purchased a lot in Nottawasaga, Malcolm Livingston born abt. 1819 was located at Concession 10 Lot 24 next to the village of Duntroon and so Malcolm and his family might be referred to as the "Duntroon Livingstons and they are buried in Duntroon Pioneer Cemetery. I am exploring the notion however that your ancestor ALexander born abt. 1815 of the Collingwood area and Malcolm born 1819 of Duntroon were brothers but finding proof may prove to be a challenge. I am hoping that a study of the ALexander and Malcolm's land tranactions in mid 19th century Nottawasaga Township might tell me something about the family origins. Perhap another clue. We will see.

regards,

Donald

[alexlivingstone]

Wow this is all facinating. I just returned from vacation and will be definitely checking in regularly. Its been great getting in touch with my uncle as its been a very long time seeing him. I am heading to the cemeteries this saturday which will be great fun.

Thanks for all the information,
Alexander

[Canadian Livingstone]

Hi Alex,

Hope you had a good holiday. I also found out that Alexander Livingston had a farm about 100 acres which included crops such as wheat, barley, oats and peas with a some hay. Oh yes he also had a small orchard on his property. Now if Alexander lived in another Township or County at the time his deed for this farm at Con. 12 Lot 38 a little west of the town of Collingwood then the deed will probably record that and then one can explore the possibility that he lived "somewhere else" before he bought the farm in Nottawasaga. That is one of things I am hoping to find out. Unlike the Medonte Township Livingstons who your family often gets mixed up with because there is also an Alexander son of Neil that resided there, I dont have information which clearly and concisely links Alexander 185 and othe Livingston Malcolm Livingston b.abt. 1819 of Nottawasaga Township to an Islay family although as I have said I am almost 100 percent certain that your Livingstons are also of Islay origin just not the children of Neil Livingston and Flora Gilchrist who clearly settled in Medonte Township according to the Upper Canada Land grant records by the year 1832. Because Neil and Dougall had land grant records indicating they received land from the Crown in 1832 in Oro and neighbouring Medonte that info was there in the case of your ancestor Alexander or any other Livingston that settled in Nottawasaga there was no land grant info so I assuming that Alexander and Malcolm purchased their farms. I am hoping to find that out tomorrow if all goes well.

regards,

Donald

[Canadian Livingstone]

Hi Alex,

The Medonte Township Livingstons are and interesting group and there is little more info on them and their origins

From the 1861 Medonte Township Personal Census and the agricultural census

Alexander Livingston b. 1819 Con. 12 Lot 3 100 acres near a village called Warminister few miles east of Craighurst
James Livingston Con. 12 Lot 3 75 acres
Ronald Livingston Con. 12 Lot 4 185 acres (Neil Livingstone age 70 and Flora Gilchrist living with Ronald Livingston)
The Killarrow Parish, Bowmore Parish Records indicate ALexander, James and Ronald were sons of Neil and Flora Gilchrist who married 1810 at Bowmore, Killarrow Parish Alexander, James and Ronald were born at a place in Kilarrow Parish called Gartnatra.

Dougall Livingston b. abt. 1802 Con. 11 Lot 5 200 acres (He received Con. 11 Lot 6 in 1832 as a "Free Grant" from the Government of Upper Canada) Note how Neil and Flora's sons all located in nearby lots to Dougall's suggesting that Dougall may a brother or some kin to Neil and family. Perhaps equally significant is the fact that the land grant records indicate that both Dougall and the Neil Livingstone b.in the 1790's that was married to Flora GilChrist received their land grants in Simcoe County, Ontario in 1832. I will leave the Medonte Livingstons for now to focus on a more challenging project that of the Nottawasaga Livingstons.