Our highland tartan

[Canadian Livingstone]

Hi All, Following the understanding

[Kyle2 MacLea]

I can only imagine, per your previous work, Donald, that this MUST have come from Bachuil.

[Canadian Livingstone]

Hi Kyle, Yes indeed you have noticed that there is some possible connection to that tartan which was apparently worn at the Battle of Culloden. ALso interesting to note that a number of clans in our so called district seem to have favoured for one reason or another variations that include large amounts of

[Kyle2 MacLea]

Dear Donald, No intent to give up on this one, certainly!

[Bachuil]

My memory is awful.

[Kyle2 MacLea]

Niall, yes! If you see Donald's original excellent thread on the Highland Society and the tartans collected, there's even more detail: http://www.clanmclea.co.uk/forum/Show-M ... sp?ID=1767 See Stewart's reply about the patterns: http://www.clanmclea.co.uk/forum/show-m ... sp?ID=1773 Another lead from Stewart: http://www.clanmclea.co.uk/forum/show-m ... sp?ID=1995 And more from Donald: http://www.clanmclea.co.uk/forum/show-m ... sp?ID=2015 Hope this helps!

[Canadian Livingstone]

Hi Niall, The correspondence from the time period that your ancestor may have been contacted (1815?) is infact somewhat indexed and located in the National Library, but I found so far no proof that the old swatch books of the Highland Society that contain the swatch page with tartan swatch submitted by the clan chief, his seal and signature. I got nowhere on that one so far. Unfortunately I put it off my search when I first took ill and didn't establish contacts with "tartan people" who might have had the inside scoop on this perplexing mystery. Maybe the original swatch books are in fact in the National library and it is just not mentioned on their web site. I did manage to find pictures of the books and saw on sample swatch page of one of the clans, also saw a sample of correspondence from a highland clan chief responding to the Highland Society request for a tartan sample. So they must be somewhere. regards Donald

[D.W.Livingston]

Hello Niall, I am very interested in this research project. I sent a query to the Manuscripts department, and the Rare Book department of the National Library of Scotland to see if they might have access to the original documents. Your statement also got me thinking, does anyone have access to a 1819 Wilson's Pattern Book? either from a library or personal collection. I would be interested in seeing what kind of information was provided in such an early book. David

[Canadian Livingstone]

Hi David, Glad to hear you contacted the library. They almost certainly would know where the Highland Society of London Swatch book is. As far I could tell up to the 1970's it was still in the hands of the Highland Society of London. I do know of course that the library has the correspondence including the early 1800's when letters between the Society and the Baron may have occurred. But the big prize will be finding that Swatch book wherever it may be. I failed to find a website for the Highland Society of London or much info beyond the fact that the tartan swatch book does very much survive somewhere and that there is a possibility and I emphasize possibility that there was a swatch submitted by Baron John Livingstone corresponding I should think what we refer to as Tartan 1003 in red, green and black While you will find a number of Livingstone tartans including the newer version of this red green and black tartan and others that are apparently not all that old, there appears to be if my hunch is correct, one original based upon whatever tartan was submitted by Baron John. That being said even if this tartan swatch was indeed submited by the Baron we still cannot be sure as to its antiquity. Kyle has suggested that the Baron may have submitted a tartan which our clan favoured which we had adopted from one of the tartans worn by another clansman who particpated wwith great bravery at Culloden. We know that our clansmans were wearing tartan before 1815 to be certain we just don't know if it was exclusive to our clan or shared with another clan. I am meaning a district tartan for example. Doesnt matter really in the end where the tartan originated. We know alot of the neighbouring clans favoured red and green in their tartans. If we can find this old Maconlea tartan swatch page that may have submitted to the Highland Society , I think we can worry later about where the Baron might have got it from. The other tartan collection you mentioned has actually been published I think as is available in book form by a tartan company or historian I noticed at one time. What caught my eye about the Highland Society of London was a reference somewhere to Livingstone Tartan 1003 originating from an old swatch submitted to the Highland Society of LOndon circa their 1815 inquiries. As there was no proof of this claim, I have been quite interesting in trying to find someone who could once and for all prove that our clan did submit a swatch at that early date. Another clue of course was the fact that none of the tartan books I consulted was never clear on where original red green black Livingstone tartan originated from or give a precise date. None of the books seemed to have found that info or looked into it in any depth. But if we find the old swatch book we can hopefully once and for all answer the question. ANd if the tartan turns out to be there we will also be able to say that this is truly a Livingstone tartan that originated from the Maconlea Livingstones and we can take some pride it that. regards Donald

[Canadian Livingstone]

Hi David, Were the Livingstones contacted by the Highland Society? Is there surviving correspondence and memoranda regarding which clans were contacted? I would think likely so. The correspondence and memoranda circa 1815 is located in the National Library, but you should know that I have been recently told by a tartan expert that the volumes and boxes containing the Highland Society of London swatch collection are in fact in National Museum of Scotland in Edinborough as I has suspected. But that being said I have some concerns that the information I was given on the forum may not be correct regarding the possible source of Tartan 1003. I also got my hands on what looks to be a reliable listing most of the Scotland Clans and the known source for the tartans. There are many that list Highland Society of London but as I originally thought no Livingston Tartans are listed. I would check with the Museum, but it is my fear that the earlier information I received on the forum that original swatch of Tartan 1003 could be found in the Highland Society of London Collection may be false. I will however keep my fingers crossed and verify this one way or another with museum officials.