Nova Scotia/PEI Livingstone Research

[Jewel]

Hello Donald,

In regards to my membership to the Cape Breton Historical Society, there has been a delay. After mailing my application and check and waiting 4 weeks!! I found out from the society that they didn't receive my information!! So I had to send it a second time and am hopeing they receive it this time. I don't know what the problem was because it was not returned to me. So I'm in the waiting mode again with hopes of success, this time I took it directly to the post office which was a week ago.

Jewel

[Canadian Livingstone]

Hi Jewel,

I am sorry to hear that. Hopefully it can be sorted out as they may be able to help us with Barry's research and you and Roberta's.
regards,
Donald

[Livingstone_PEI]

Well

I went to the land registry office today, and pretty much they drew a blank. I did get a copy of the crown grant, and guess what it is dated 1896 and it is Colin's son name, John, dated 1896. I asked why the crown land grant would be in John's name and not Colin's and they didn't know. I have a copy of the map and will add it tomorrow, once I can scan the document.

So my day didn't endt there. I went back to the archives and met with some success. I found the ledger document with all of Colin's payments on the land in Forest Hill and there was a note where he died in 1867 and the land passed to his son. Colin made his first payment on the land on November 15, 1865. So that is very helpful, we know that Colin lived on PEI a very short time before his death. I'm just speculating, but maybe deeds weren't issued on land until it was paid in full. The Registry office said that before 1935, on PEI, when property was willed to a family member they did not need to have a new deed for the property. I am getting a copy of the ledger document and will add it to the forum uploads tomorrow too. The note is very hard to understand and I had two staff at the archives look at it for me to see if there is any important information on it that I am missing, and they didn't see anything. The writing on the attached note is terrible handwriting and if anyone has any thoughts on transcribing it when I post it feel free.

I did look though the 1861 PEI census for lots 53, 54 and 55 and suprisingly did not find any Livingstons in it. This is odd because in 1841 census and 1881 census there are Livingstons living in this area. Why there is a lapse in 1861, I do not know.

So the hunt goes on
Barry

[Canadian Livingstone]

Hi Barry,

Well then you had some success at the archives and you checked the land registry office. So it is as we suspected that he acquired the land in the 1860's and died not long after he had acquired it. And you cant find him in the 1861 PEI Census in Lot 55. Then he likely was stil at Whycocomagh. The other thing is by checking the birth dates and locations of his sons John and Angus we can determine that he still in Cape Bretons in the 1850's so chances are he was still there in 1861. I think if he was in PEI in the early 1860's the entried would have been well before 1865. He would not have wasted any time locating on his new property and establishing a farm. So lets assume that prior to 1865 he was still at Whycocomagh. Now if the Cape Breton Historical Society can explain that reference in the records to Colleen Livingston at Whycocomagh and who submitted that it would be helpful. It was not Dr. St. Clair and was not me and I assume someone who has reason to believe the Colin was at Whycocomagh or actually found a record census of 1861 indicating that. I want to find from the Cape Breton Historical Society where that information about Colin at Whycoccmagh in the 1861 census came from that your researcher told you about. I want to trace it right to the source. I think our library actually has the 1861 Cape Breton Census but when went through it quickly I did not see Colin Livingstone. I want to recheck it though. It was hard to read. I could not figure out how the towns and villages were identified.

I am sorry to hear that the visit to the land registry office proved to be a fruitless search but I delighted to hear that a return visit to the archives was more rewarding. THis has been a tough research project for you but at least you have found a little more information for your efforts. I was hoping they would be able to help you at the archives if not the registry office.

regards,

Donald

[Canadian Livingstone]

HI Barry,

THey had no information on who was the original owner of that land and whom Colin made the payments to. Colin likely paid an agent in PEI if the owner was an absentee owner in England. Could you tell if the name of the owner in England and his town was recorded on the payment ledger or was he justing paying a local land agent or lawyer acting on behalf of the original Absentee land owner and grantor of land. See if there is any information on the docuuments including the 1890's document on the original land owner, grantor etc. THis may be all that there is and it may be that there are no original land transaction documents available. What you found at the archives may be all that survives. Funny no one know anything of the original owners of the land around Forest Hill. I tried looking for a Forest hill Historian but could not find one.

regards,

Donald

[Roberta Ann]

Hi Barry;

Can you answer this question? When was Legistation passed that allowed for only residents of PEI could acquire property on the Island? Is this Law still in force?

Regards;

Roberta

[Livingstone_PEI]

Hi Roberta

Hmmmm.....I don't believe that has ever been a law. I do know that cottage owners on PEI pay a much higher property tax if they are not a full time resident. I think it is about double what everyone else pays, but anyone is free to purchase property on PEI. Now we do have some of the most stringent land protection laws in Canada, for instance you cannot just buy farm land and then subdivide it for development. There are many environmental protection laws that must be abided by as well. If you want to move to PEI, anyone can buy property and live here. We have friends that moved here from British Columbia and they say this area of PEI is the best kept secret in Canada lol.

Barry

[Canadian Livingstone]

Hello Maclea Livingstone Research Commitee,

As with Barry's challenging ancestral queries regardind his PEI ancestors there are limitations to the length, width and breadth of our knowledge. We can utilize whatever Knowledge, experience and research tools we possess but at some point it is advantageous to confer with experts in the specific region we are researching should we reach an impass. These experts may be experienced local historians or archivists who may have a wealth of knowledge regarding local families, settlement information, land records, cemetery records etc. Often access to such people is only an e-mail or phone call away. Some but not all of these persons work for a government funded archives or are volunteers happy that someone has an interest in their area of research and willing to assist.

While Barry's project has presented challenges for him, he has managed to find some important records along the way that have given him some vital information on his ancestor Colin. I think Barry's recent experience at the PEI archives is similiar to mine at the Ontario Archives on a number of family research projects. Sometimes it takes a second return visit and a fresh start with the records to locate something that you may have overlooked the first time. Sometimes many trips to the archives.The first time you usually go the obvious information sources, Census records, indexed birth and deaths, land records and then the second time other sources less travelled by the average family researcher that may require more effort to locate. With my own family research having been completely done more or less, I am now on the lookout for those hard to find obscure bits of information that I may stumble upon by accident once every few years. Its a joy when all the documents are indexed by family but that is not always the case and sometimes you just stumble upon some incredible family related document by accident. That has infact happened to me a few times where I have found some amazing family history related document while looking for something else and it was fantastic. For every time I get lucky there are just as many time when I find nothing at the archives, though I have had a pretty good success rate with my own family research. I guess you just have to be patient.

regards,

Donald

[Kyle MacLea]

Great points, Donald.

When we all stumble on those difficult to find, but revelatory family history documents, I hope we'll share that information here on the Forum. That will really help others to learn from what you found! And even if the document itself is not enlightening, the process of how you found it, might be!

So, thanks all, for sharing your wisdom AND your knowledge!

Kyle=

[Livingstone_PEI]

Hi All

I've attached the crown grant map for Colin's farm. After spending a little time going over it, I think it provides some hints to the history of land titlement on PEI in the early years. It seems like the gentleman at the Registry office implied, deeds weren't a required document pre 1935. There are many additional properties here that only list a ledger document, but there are some that also list a registered deed. Have a look if you like. I'm picking up the ledger document today, and welcome any thoughts on the transcription of the information, and the handwriting is attrocious.

Barry